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View Full Version : goofy question, just curious...


rich novak
12-23-2003, 02:47 AM
i'm wondering why i haven't seen any dual processor laptops out there? maybe xeons or opterons, or athlons? surely with the larger chassis available nowadays (toshiba p10 or p25 for instance...) they could cram the components in and find a way to cool them?

so why not? and how hard would it be?

the reason i ask, is because i'm constantly traveling, in the military, and it would be nice to have something powerful that i could *fold up* and take with me.

thanks all,

ren

NightSky
12-23-2003, 02:53 AM
I think the biggest reason would probably be the heating issue. I've got a Dell Inspiron 8200 P4 2Ghtz that's a year old, which I do most my 3d stuff on now, but it tends to get pretty hot. It's been a pretty good little machine though (it weighs 15 lbs w/ 2 batteries). I think it's safe to assume, however that companies are working on something like a double-processor laptop.

singularity2006
12-23-2003, 04:01 AM
yeah, heat is definitely an issue. I think the other issue is power consumption. Having another CPU would really suck up a lot of power. And to get the same battery life as a single CPU laptop, u'd probably end up w/ something really heavy.... 15lb is quite a whopper w/ two batteries. But then again, w/ the advent of the Centrino, I'm pretty sure someone somewhere is thinking of doing a dual based on the ideas that make Centrino run.

rich novak
12-23-2003, 04:39 AM
i don't understand centrino... i think my brain keeps comparing it to celeron...

if i wanted to create a system with no battery (to save space, and lower weight) like a laptop that needs to be plugged in...

i want a powerfll system i could take anywhere. a notebook formfactor is the main thing... i wonder just how possible it would be...

OC-NightHawk
12-23-2003, 05:51 AM
That could be feasable, but we are back to the heat issue again. A typical processor generates around 45 degrees (Celcious). If you factor that by two then its easy to see that in such a small space heat would be almost uncontrolable. If a intake/exhasut windtunnel was built into the whole case it might be doable. Without a battery it would be easier to work with it. I'm not sure about how well the system would sell overall though. It is a nice concept though, but without the market for it the concept is a risk. Then again risks can pay off big. Maybe somebody here in the industry should start taking notes. :) I wouldn't mind having a easily transportable machine like this.

NightSky
12-23-2003, 07:40 AM
About a month or so ago, I read about the guys in California that built one of the fastest supercomputers from 1200 Apple G5s for only about $10 mil. I just graduated college a couple days ago, but when I was attending school, I worked at the school's virtual reality center, & our programmers had developed a cluster of pc's all connected together to run the large caves & virtual environments. The reason I bring this up is because I think the way computing is headed, small clusters of interchangable parts, much like your multiprocessor desktops, can greatly increase your power, for less cost & faster computing. For instance, you could probably make a bunch of very small processors, about the speed of a palm pilot or such, combine them all together into a laptop, that would essentially be faster than a single processor laptop, as well as have the ability to add cpus or decrease cpus, based upon your needs. I don't always carry my second battery in my laptop, because of its weight.

On the heat & battery issue, they are making large advancements in battery technology, as well as using alternate forms of heat dissapation, such as liquid nitrogen (in a controlled manner of course), etc.

I agree, I think a multiprocessor laptop, or highend laptop would be very nice. I'm always envious of the graphic design kids, like my sister, who have these nice apple 17" monitor mac laptops (I like the style of macs, but prefer pcs), and use them for photoshop, flash mx, dreamweaver, illustrator, etc. They don't need the high power us cg people require, & therefore can take their job anywhere. It will eventually get there for us, I know. I just have to realize, it doesn't always take the fastest computer to accomplish great art. I mean, look at the artwork that was done a couple of years ago with just PII 300 MHtz machines! :beer:

rich novak
12-24-2003, 12:00 AM
that's it, i'm doing it. i'm going to learn how to build a computer, then i'm going to make a dual xeon or dual opteron laptop. maybe i can even use it without burning down the house? that would be a plus!

so step one, where can i find some good info on building a computer? if there's any one thing i can claim to be, it's inventive. someone used the term "wind tunnel" and that's exactly what i'm thinking. maybe a fan in front and a fan in back... maybe some dry ice or liquid nitrogen :) who knows?

ok, can anyone recommend a good book for this topic? i need to know the different components needed to make a computer run, and how i can choose correctly to make them work together...

thanks all!

singularity2006
12-24-2003, 01:27 AM
Originally posted by rich novak
that's it, i'm doing it. i'm going to learn how to build a computer, then i'm going to make a dual xeon or dual opteron laptop.

I don't think u can build your own laptop...... no one sells standalone LCD's do they? And keyboards and all those other proprietary parts? o.0

Anyhow, Centrino's main point of focus is the fact that it is low power consumption. It's kind of like an underclocked CPU, sort of. But not really. It runs considerably less speed than the typical P4 but because of this, it works great at long battery life (6 hours if u buy external batteries ... might be more) and low heat. That's the selling point, battery life. As for the wireless capability that Intel was touting, I'm not sure what part that plays in Centrino. But what caught my eye was low power consumption and low heat production.

NightSky
12-24-2003, 01:41 AM
[/quote]As for the wireless capability that Intel was touting, I'm not sure what part that plays in Centrino.[quote]

Ya, about 6 months after I bought my P4 laptop, Centrino came out, & they were bragging about how "it's built for wireless" more than the regular mobile, or P4-M. I've got a wireless adapter built into my laptop, which works just fine for me!!!:buttrock: Also, I would think you would give up some computing power with the lower power drain. Really, if you're going to do anything 3d with a laptop, I doubt you would be very far away from a power outlet, even in a coffee shop or something.

singularity2006
12-24-2003, 05:07 AM
Originally posted by NightSky
As for the wireless capability that Intel was touting, I'm not sure what part that plays in Centrino.

Ya, about 6 months after I bought my P4 laptop, Centrino came out, & they were bragging about how "it's built for wireless" more than the regular mobile, or P4-M. I've got a wireless adapter built into my laptop, which works just fine for me!!!:buttrock: Also, I would think you would give up some computing power with the lower power drain. Really, if you're going to do anything 3d with a laptop, I doubt you would be very far away from a power outlet, even in a coffee shop or something.

yah, most definitely. The centrino is for the business user. The power user for CG will be plugged in I would imagine, or in the least, doing just wireframe work on a Centrino and render on a workstation.

NightSky
12-24-2003, 06:16 AM
I've been very very happy with my Dell Inspiron. I know some people don't like Dells, but for laptops, it has been the best investment I've made all year. I think it's been constantly running for the whole semester, except for if I take it to campus. I basically use it for setting scenes & even rendering sometimes. Most high poly work I do starts out at the low-poly level, so it's been very good. Tends to slow down evey once in a while, especially if I have a bunch of controllers on a character or something. For now it's working great, but I assume I'll upgrade in another year or so, & the one I upgrade to will be twice as fast.

One trend I'm happy to see as a consumer is the speed of computers compared to the low low prices. In another thread I saw talk of a fast system for about $400. To give you a comparison, my laptop is twice as fast as my large home built machine from 3 years ago that I paid almost a grand for, & I can take my laptop with me!!!!:beer:

CGLearner
12-24-2003, 07:11 PM
You can actually buy specific parts directly from an OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) if you have access to them, or from a computer parts store if you don't.

The only problem with going to the OEM is you often have to buy in bulk, so you have to buy like 4 motherboards at once.

Computer equipment stores work really well, and there are a lot of them in most areas. Some are pure evil though. I have a great nightmare story of one in Utah (EBC). But in either case you should do some research into the parts you are looking for and find out what manufacturer of parts you want to buy (ie: Intel, Pentium, etc.).

NightSky
12-24-2003, 09:06 PM
Now you got me all curious! What's your nightmare story??:bounce:

rich novak
12-25-2003, 01:15 AM
i just thought of something...

rack servers are pretty slim... slimmer than some notebooks i've seen. i wonder if i could get a dual processor server board and components into a laptop case...?

does the video card have to plug right into the motherboard? or can it be side by side, connected with a flexible cable?

ideas...

GregHess
12-25-2003, 03:00 AM
You can do it rich...in fact, there is an entire company whose sole purpose is doing it :).

http://www.maxvision.com/

Only problems you run into are...

1) Power
2) Heat
3) Battery life (if any).

singularity2006
12-25-2003, 06:04 AM
Greg, that's damn savage! That looks like that one Sony... .can't recall the name @ the moment. But it's the one with the nice wide screen display and seemingly built in base unit and keyboard and when the keyboard flips up, the remaining top half of the display turns into a digital clock (pardon the run-on... thinking of that laptop makes me giddy:applause: )

rich novak
12-25-2003, 07:19 AM
speaking of sony, i wonder why they don't offer any xeon/opteron systems? unless i'm not looking in the right area...?

that maxvision stuff looks great! thanks for the link! a bit expensive but that may be the case no matter what.

thanks! and merry christmas!

CGLearner
12-27-2003, 12:24 AM
All right, here's my nightmare story.... But I'm warning you, it could give geeks everywhere nightmares.... Well, maybe not...

Anyways...
I have a friend who runs the website www.utahlanparty.com. He has a big LAN party scheduled one evening, however earlier in the day, his NIC card and Video Card go out.

Now he has a lot of OEM accounts, so he can go directly back to the manufacturer and buy the equipment directly, but they would have to ship it to him. So instead he goes to EBC, a local computer parts store....

He buys the NIC card and the video card and takes them home. Finds out they are both Dead as can be. Just to make sure he swaps out each card with some of his other equipment and they run fine. So he returns to EBC.

First he explains the Video Card. They tell him that problem must be something with his motherboard. Well, he tested it and knows it works fine. Still they won't accept a return or exchange. He raises a commotion. Finally they say they will test it and come back after two days.

Next he brings up the NIC card. The tech once again says it has to be the motherboard. So after a few minutes of fighting back and forth, the tech gets a senior tech. He agrees to test it. Ten minutes later he comes out of the back room and says it works fine. My friend says prove it. He says if he can show him that it works, he will take it home with him and count his loss. The tech says no one is allowed in the back room. Finally he fights them enough they let him back.

There is no computer set up to do the test, so they have to put one together. It takes them 30 minutes just to do that.

So they test it and sure enough its dead. So they swap it out for him.

So he leaves, and uses a low end video card for the night. Comes back two days later and they tell him the video card is good. Finally he just bites the cost and says they are never getting his business again. The tech returns with, "Yes we will. you idiots will always continue to buy from us."

Now, as I said earlier, he has several OEM accounts, so he called the manufacterer of the video card directly to report EBC. He says he wantes to complain about one of their distrubutors. They ask where he's from. He says from Utah. They ask, "Is it EBC?" :curious:

Bad news when they know right off the bat who it is... So he decides to call the OEM of the NIC card to complain too. When they find out he's from Utah, "Oh, is it EBC?".

Bad sign.

His friend went to the and bought a DVD rom. Didn't work. He took it back, they said they'd look into it. Gets a call two days later to pick it up. Goes in they say it is good. Opens the box. Sticky note on DVD rom says hold for two days and return to customer.

Now here's the moral of the story. I work for a big company that shall remain nameless full of computer tech's. We do trouble shooting. He is a trainer for this company. He trains a bit under 1000 people... er um... computer geeks a year, end every training session he uses this example...

Bad person to mistreat.

Anyways, theres my scary story to the best that I can remember it.

rich novak
12-27-2003, 01:03 AM
that's a crappy company. i don't like the roads in utah, but now i know i'm never gonna live there!

CGLearner
12-27-2003, 01:10 AM
I like living here, but there certainly aren't a lot of cg jobs here.

GregHess
12-27-2003, 02:02 AM
http://www.resellerratings.com/seller1802.html

Always use resellerratings.com.

Its simple, its quick, it saves you thousands of dollars.

rich novak
12-27-2003, 02:35 AM
i'm going crazy! i can't find a single company who builds laptop shells for resale. it's like dell, fujitsu, gateway, etc... just pull these things out of their butts.

i wonder if i can maybe build the damned case myself...? :)

CGLearner
12-27-2003, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by GregHess
http://www.resellerratings.com/seller1802.html

Always use resellerratings.com.

Its simple, its quick, it saves you thousands of dollars.

Wow... A whole lot of scary stories!! *shudder*

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