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RobertoOrtiz
12-16-2003, 07:41 PM
Quote

"Crest Communications, one of the leaders in 3D animation in India, has big plans up its sleeve. It is constantly looking to set benchmarks in this arena. One of the major projects it is making compares favourably with the Disney Pixar hit Finding Nemo. In addition, the company is currently negotiating with European and Canadian companies for contracts worth several millions of dollars.

Indiantelevision.com's correspondent Ashwin Pinto met Crest's international business head A K Madhavan who spoke about the companyís projects, why it is shifting out of the Indian market and why 2D animation is restricted in scope.


What are the main challenges facing the growth of 3D animation in India?
Primarily, in India, there is a shortage of skilled people. There are not enough skill sets available. I need 300 animators in the next year. The talent pool does not exist.

Another challenge will be train and motivate them by giving them exciting projects to work on. The technical side is there. In terms of the infrastructure like delivery platforms India, is ready.


How far away are you from producing a film like 'Finding Nemo'?

We are already there. We have made a television series once again for the US market, which is entirely set underwater. This is the first time television has seen animation of this high calibre. It is certainly comparable to the marvellous work that Pixar did on Finding Nemo in terms of the quality of animation.

This series is going to outperform what we have already done. In fact, I can safely say, India is ready to do a sequel to Finding Nemo. The story is all about a few submarines. It is a preschool series.

Animation on water is very difficult to create and render. It calls in for a huge computing power. The lighting effect underwater is very complex to create on the computer. This is yet another example of us setting benchmarks for television. The cost of each half hour episode is in excess of $ two million and will start airing next year. The coral reefs, the fishes were all created right here in Mumbai.
"

>>link<< (http://www.indiantelevision.com/interviews/y2k3/executive/akmadhavan.htm)

-R

Bupa
12-16-2003, 08:21 PM
any link to this studio ?

FloydBishop
12-16-2003, 09:16 PM
Why not just make your film/show/short, and let the viewers decide if it measures up to Pixar quality or not?

"I can do (insert achievement here) just as good as (insert person or studio here)."

Just do it. Let the viewers decide.

Tooting your own horn too much will make you go blind.

It's impolite, in my opinion.

boboroshi
12-16-2003, 10:43 PM
It's not just the animators that Pixar has. It's the PhDs, and the story tellers, and the craft of making a great animated feature that even people like dreamworks have had a hard time competing with (anyone remember "Ants"?)

NanoGator
12-16-2003, 11:01 PM
Hmm... so USA hires programmers from India, India hires animators from USA. Fair trade?

GRMac13
12-17-2003, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by Bupa
any link to this studio ?

Found some info on their PBS show here:

http://pbskids.org/jakers/

All in all it's not bad. Pretty good for TV, actually. But it falls far short of Pixar quality. I hope they have much more up their sleeve if they hope to compete with the likes of Nemo.

projectcoil
12-17-2003, 02:47 AM
Originally posted by NanoGator
Hmm... so USA hires programmers from India, India hires animators from USA. Fair trade?

People hire people. Is it fair to call some people patriotic and others loyalists when they all serve their country?

keithlango
12-17-2003, 02:54 AM
I love the fact that the blatant contradiction is completely lost on this fellow. They claim Pixar quality greatness in the same conversation that they readily admit the skillsets aren't in place to accomplish said feat. Classic.

It seems to be all the rage for new studios to declare their ability to achieve equality with Pixar in press releases. Didn't IBM do that earlier this year? And I'm certain I've read of a few others as well. AWN always has those press releases. It's been so frequent that I'm guessing that "Pixar Quality Animation" will be a new entry in the 2004 Merriam-Webster Dictionary. Next to the definition will be an IDT logo.

:D



-k

ps: all Michael Eisner needs to do to get the upper hand in his contract negotiations with Pixar is to build or buy a cheapo animation studio in Asia and to put out some press releases. I'm a genius!!

aazimkhan
12-17-2003, 03:35 AM
Hey, havent u heard of "easier said - than done".
They have said it, lets just wait and see if they can do it..

Pixar is unique, and i personally think the only studio that is close to pixar is BlueSky with Ice Age.

Crest Comm from India, well I personally havent seen any real great work from them yet, So I dont know what is this new project standing on.

...lets wait and see...

GRMac13
12-17-2003, 04:43 AM
Originally posted by projectcoil
People hire people. Is it fair to call some people patriotic and others loyalists when they all serve their country?

Actually, people hire help. They'll hire the cheapest, fastest help anytime, regardless of country (and sometimes even regardless of quality).

SheepFactory
12-17-2003, 07:49 AM
Originally posted by GRMac13
Actually, people hire help. They'll hire the cheapest, fastest help anytime, regardless of country (and sometimes even regardless of quality).


true , but you never get pixar quality by taking the cheap route :)

It's just so sad that these execs think Pixar is successful just cause they make movies in 3d. It seems they overlook that pixar employ some of the best people in the industry , they take their time with their movies , they never take the easy route and most importantly pixar never does a movie without a solid script.

hell for finding nemo they sent the team to scubadive , to experience firsthand how underwater is.
they dont just google for "fish" and get to work they do their research properly.

so if other studios want to attain pixar quality in their movies they need to realize that they are not going to get it by cutting down on the cost and quality.

Emmanuel
12-17-2003, 10:31 AM
Did You guys notice in the interview how he tells about how many people they are gonna hire ?
Seems like he also thinks that sheer manpower is a good substitute for sheer creativity.
But nonetheless, India is such a poor country that I hope they can make themselves famous in this business.

Peter Reynolds
12-17-2003, 11:18 PM
So do you get the impression they are people who live to tell great stories and want to push the artform, or does it smell like: "get rid of your animators and use US because we're just as good and we're a lot cheaper." ?

boboroshi
12-17-2003, 11:30 PM
Originally posted by Peter Reynolds
So do you get the impression they are people who live to tell great stories and want to push the artform, or does it smell like: "get rid of your animators and use US because we're just as good and we're a lot cheaper." ?

The latter. Sadly.

MDuffy
12-17-2003, 11:44 PM
This is the thing that worries me. This company isn't going to (likely) hire animators outside of India; they are looking for native talent. Now I don't know how much their animators make, but according to this article from Oct of last year (http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/2002/10/13/stories/2002101301560100.htm) in Mumbai, India apparently the going rate for 2D animators is Rs 7000 for entry level, and Rs 40,000 for 3 yrs experience. From this article:

"Talking about the remunerations offered in this segment, Mr Shukul says that the profession is immensely lucrative and a starter can easily make anywhere between Rs 6,000 and Rs 7,000 to begin with, which could easily go up to any where between Rs 30,000 and Rs 40,000 within a span of three years, depending on his capabilities."


I'm assuming that is their monthly salary (please correct me on any of this if I'm wrong.) Now if "Rs" is the Indian Ruppe and it trades for about 45.5 Ruppe to the US dollar, (http://www.exchangerate.com/world_rates.html?cont=Asia), then they are making $153US/mo to start, and $879US/mo with experience. And this is considered extremely lucrative. That's $10,500US a year.

And Crest Communications isn't looking to develop anything for their native market, they only target international markets.

Ouch.

Later,
Michael Duffy

Dearmad
12-18-2003, 12:00 AM
QUOTE:
------
A few of our software are ahead of even what some studios in the US use. Jakers! The Adventures Of Piggley Winks was developed using a software called XSI, which was made by Soft Image. It is the industry's first truly non-linear animation (NLA) system for the film, commercial/broadcast and games markets.
-------


WTF?!?!?

Wow, when do we get to use this new fangled "Soft Image" program on this side of the world? I wonder genius in their studio is responsible for programming something like THAT! He'll be rich soon, I'm sure.

Hash AM is non-freaking-linear!

But you can't fault the empirical truth of his thinking: sure, his studio has software my (home vanity bullshit hobby) studio doesn't. Maybe.

Dearmad
12-18-2003, 12:03 AM
I just can't stand this reasoning:

Interviewer: How close are you to creating animation like Pixar's toy story.

Dearmad: Oh, I'm already there- I've animated a ten second clip using toys as the main characters already! Lots of specularity and shiny plastic textures and hardwood floors. I even made my voice sound like Tom Hanks'! Screw Pixar, go with Dearmad Animation!

Array
12-18-2003, 12:14 AM
pfffft....Pixar quality? :rolleyes:

I'll believe it when I see it. Every time Pixar comes out with a new movie, it raises the bar for everyone else. By the time everyone catches up, Pixar raises the bar again.

dmeyer
12-18-2003, 01:12 AM
Originally posted by RobertoOrtiz
The cost of each half hour episode is in excess of $ two million and will start airing next year.


How long do they expect the series to last? $2 Million per episode for an unproven studio creating programming with a limited audience?

It sounds like by their logic the quality of your work scales linearly with the size of your renderfarm. It's not the size that counts...it's how you use it (the renderfarm :blush: )

Goon
12-18-2003, 02:20 AM
Originally posted by dmeyer
How long do they expect the series to last? $2 Million per episode for an unproven studio creating programming with a limited audience?

Here is the mentioned TV show. It doesn't look bad at all: http://pbskids.org/jakers/

Also they mention "so far Rich Crest has produced six full-length animated feature films and over 60 half-hour animation projects for various studios, including its own Animated Hero Classics series. This enjoyed a two-year run on HBO in the US.", so they are not exactly unproven, nor short term.

Are they on par with pixar? I haven't seen their actual work yet, but as Pixar is one of the Industry standards, and this studio doesn't seem to be a big name yet, I'm going to guess no.

But is there any reason they cannot get there? As mentioned, with their focus on computing power, equating a undersea show they did with Nemo is a bit off, it is also doubtful that they value talent as much. Plus india doesn't seem to be making a big splash in the cg community as far as artwork (i'm basing that on having seen NO Indian work go through the galleries yet), there is likely a smaller talent pool. So making Pixar quality might be a dubious brag, but simply dismissing them on that might be a mistake.
Warez is cheap, the field pays well, so if computers of capable specs are accessible, a boom in employable talent is possible (anyone care to comment on that? I have no idea how wired india is).
Stuff like the simpsons is animated overseas all of the time. While that is a slightly different situation, being mainly 2d tweens, it doesn't mean the same thing can't happen. And its companies like this will be the ones doing the work.

GRMac13
12-18-2003, 04:34 AM
Originally posted by Goon
Also they mention "so far Rich Crest has produced six full-length animated feature films and over 60 half-hour animation projects for various studios, including its own Animated Hero Classics series. This enjoyed a two-year run on HBO in the US.", so they are not exactly unproven, nor short term.

Were these "6 full-length animated feature films" released in theaters or were they direct to video? As for the 30 minutes episodes, I posted a link to the PBS show eariler. And as I said, it does look pretty good for a TV show. But "good for TV" and "capable of competing in theaters opposite Pixar" are still light years apart. The only thing that even comes close at all IMO is Jimmy Neutron. But even JN suffers in certain ways from the inevitable tight deadlines and smaller budgets common for TV productions. The budget and production schedules for TV are incredibly different in scope than those for feature film, and that seems to be overlooked drastically in this article. Of course, that's not to say that the talent isn't there. There are plenty of artists and animators working at non-film studios who's talent compares with that of Pixar's animators (Kieth Lango comes to mind ;) But the talent of the TD's, animators, modelers and texture artists means little if the management cannot get their act together in terms of scheduling, organization, pipeline implementation, etc. Not to mention the most important aspect...story development. Without that, you may as well take the money for your budget and make a bonfire. Square proved all of this with FF:TSW. Some amazing talent was definitely on display there, but the lack of solid story-telling techniques sunk the ship. I hope these guys are aware of all this, because judging by the comments of their head honcho, they seem to be underestimating the process. I found a link to their site on Google, but it's down. :shrug:

www.crestindia.com

backtolive
09-14-2004, 02:09 AM
Q. Why there are no original ideas from India.??
A. No one has the brains or balls to start up a project and run it from scratch to finish. "If I think of quality, may be i will loose money.. So let me think of money first and quality can be compromised..". I have heard this talk for the past 4 years in this industry.

Q. Why do indians like foreign animations - Disney, Pixar, Dreamworks stuff?
A. Where is quality in Indian works??Works from US touch our heart whereas Indian works make us feel that "this country will never progress"...

Q. Who are the CG/Animation producers in India.
A. Normal graduates who love to get a top level job who were formally educated by the stupid hopeless indian education system who cant even differenciate between green and red

Q. Who all started the companies in India.??
A. Failed IT businessmen.. Previously they were into training institutes where C++ and Java was given for $100 and 2 months. When IT boomed in India, they invested and lost cash.. When CG started booming again they invested and now going to loose cash...

Q. Who are the CEO/COO?
A. Previously Soap salesman who dreamed of giving interviews to media and talking in meetings. When there was a boom, they got inside..

Q. Who are animators?
A. People who got trained(cheated) from institutes and who want to make some money for his daily bread and butter. Who expected company will give him life and finally found out that company took his life...

Rich was one company in US and Crest brought it when the company was about to close...
reason: advertisement... Crest doesnt have any capacity to make even one feature film.. Quality is OK... adjustable even for TV... screwing all the animators and making dollars from India is Crest Policy. Most of the companies in India do the same kind of cheap marketing techniques and some fresh producers in US fall into the trap...

refer to
http://www.angelfire.com/film/indiancg/ and

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=164884 for crest special

for the remainings of once heated up discussion...

MikeRhone
09-14-2004, 03:13 AM
I usually avoid these outsourcing threads, but I wanted to add somthing I have been hearing. Through several unrelated sources I have heard many India companies are DYING for talent. Schools and companies are in dire need it seems. I have seen a few places that are offering unbeleivable salaries to people with any experience. I'de consider putting my name out there if I had an interest in moving out to Dubai...

At the risk of drawing a lot of heat, if you're willing to live abroad for a few years there are BIG bucks to be made ou there. India might be known for cheap overseas labor in 2d animation right now, but I forsee a dark future where that will also be the case for 3d.

As for this particular company and article... He must be targeting his shpiel to investors, not to taunt those in the industry. No industry pros would ever be so bold as to compare themselves to the arguably best cg animation company in the world. Especially when all he has is a warehouse full of of empty workstations. Then again, he may have taken a new twist on an old quote:

"Given time, an infinite number of monkeys on an infinte number of workstations will eventually reproduce the works of Pixar."

Mysterious X
09-14-2004, 04:39 AM
Pixar is unique, and i personally think the only studio that is close to pixar is BlueSky with Ice Age.

comeone man !!...bluesky is not even close...ice age was just fine

Andyman
09-14-2004, 05:43 AM
I'm not sure I understand your post, Mysterious X. Are you agreeing or disagreeing with him?

//

BlueSky did an amazing job on IceAge. They came up with something on their own. Sure it doesn't look like Pixar made it, but that doesn't mean it's any less quality. It has it's own, quality style.

The guys are Pixar are absolutly amazing, no doubt, but they're not gods. Not that I know of anyway.... =p.

Mysterious X
09-14-2004, 02:26 PM
Andyman, I disagree...what he mentioned was BlueSky is the only studio close to pixar...in my openion the only close studio to pixar is dream works...Blue Sky did just an okay job..i think Ice Age was only successful because of the cast and the sense of humor in the movie...animation was flat and textures were bad !..still that's my own openion and i respect yours and his :)

slaughters
09-14-2004, 02:58 PM
...Tooting your own horn too much will make you go blind....Unless the whole point is to attract attention and publicity to your studio so you can get the funding/talent pool/ect that enables you to create your own horn.

iayestaran
09-14-2004, 05:47 PM
Mysterious, you might want to have your eyes checked! Textures in Ice Age were bad? dude, what planet are you from? Texturing and lighting in ice age was some of the best I've seen; especially in the environments and in the fur on Manny the mammoth; oh, and lets not forget the whole ice cave sequence. Animation wise, the whole dodo and snowboarding sequences, were top notch. You're way off with your comment! let's see some of yours?

DangerAhead
09-14-2004, 05:52 PM
People hire people. Is it fair to call some people patriotic and others loyalists when they all serve their country?No one in my country is serving me... They're serving corporations and excel spread sheets.

I'm going to India.

------------- not 30 seconds later -----------------

I just got a call off my demoreel. *gulp* interview. *gulp* I hope this leads to something.

creative destructions
09-14-2004, 06:06 PM
Here's an old thread.

edit: and I read everything above.

pogonip
09-14-2004, 06:07 PM
I don't see how they are going to pull this off ?? You needs LOTS of senior level talent to make these films and they are struggeling to find anyone with CG expereince ...it's almost laughable ! I bet they get a lot of American college grads looking for expereince to come over and it would be a good idea to it's nearly impossible to find a film related Ch job here without many years of expereince . Though I think they will find the ultra strict work enviroment in India a shock ..

Stonepilot
09-14-2004, 07:56 PM
My favorite part of the whle tread.


"How far away are you from producing a film like 'Finding Nemo'?

We are already there. We have made a television series once again for the US market, which is entirely set underwater. "

WTF. ahhahahahha

Mysterious X
09-15-2004, 12:01 AM
iayestaran, well...maybe my eyes aren't functioning well..but that's my own openion and i'll stick to it...lighting was alright and textures were bad....:shrug:

backtolive
09-15-2004, 12:19 AM
My favorite part of the whle tread.
"How far away are you from producing a film like 'Finding Nemo'?
We are already there. We have made a television series once again for the US market, which is entirely set underwater. "
WTF. ahhahahahha

this joke is still in the walls of crest... I think project has gone underwater ... Wakeup... nemo... Wakeup... and run nemo run... Crest wants to animate you.. and that too on a special software called "XSI"...lol... atleast the reporters who take these kinda foolish interviews should show have some idea about what excatly happens...

I will appreciate if someone could put some light into people over here about the mighty "Mike Young" and "WildBrain" productions... Are these people having some great name and value in international market... ??

speedofheat
09-15-2004, 09:16 AM
Well!! you cant blame them for trying to sell themselves. Developers from small countries rarely get a chance to showcase their original skills and property. Most animation houses in India act like low cost BPOs for big studios and production houses from the developed countries. So, once in a way, when an Indian company develops something new and unique, they try their best to extract maximum leverage out of it.

In any case, it would be interesting to see the quality of the work that they claim is "already there" with the likes of Nemo.

;) Cheers !!

d_jnaneswar
09-15-2004, 02:32 PM
wow.. another "Indian Thread" :
man.. somethings wrong with this world...
Cant download the dreel of crest from its website and cant talk much bout its quality....But I worked for Jadoo works and the work there rocks.. It was certainly high above my expectations before I started working there. but as soon as I saw the first episode promo of a tv series.. I was flat.. It was very good. The animation quality was very good.. rendering technicalities might not be as good as Jimmy N.. but certainly the animation was awsome..("US quality" in my opinion..) and.. certainly wayyyy better than "Noddy".. and I dont know who made noddy.. and the production schedules are atleast as tight as jimmy N and budget way less in my estimation atleast..
So the point I want to make is.. I dont know how good Crest is but I know Jadoo is very good and this "very good" acceptably is far and far below Pixar..(but matches up to many dreels of US studios ive seen online...)...(Much of 2d talent which worked on disney stuff is doing 3d in jadoo works...and their animation is amazing..)
Just like every studio there are hack workers and there are genii and Ive seen more than a couple in Jadoo who are very very good(animators as well as overall art aesthetics).. I was catching up and catching up in quality and trying to be atleast good enuff there and these guys looked like mountain giants to me..And these guys cranked out stuff like mad... they used to give 9 to 14 secs a day of highest quality stuff.. If you see work of "Jadoo works" you will see some scenes extremely well animated and some are not that good... so u can understand what im talking about..

now as far as talent availablity.. the talent pool can accumilate very fast.. believe me.. we produce people like pancakes and many are very very conducive to learning and when there is a stable career option people are gonna jump into it.. It was this economy slump that saved animation industry.. people were not sure of getting into animation as they had bad experiences with the dotcom bubble.. now they are finally getting on to it.. really.. and crest can have its people hopefully by the end of two years.. again this force wont even match to 50 %of pixar quality IMO..but it will certainly match up to other studios in US and other places (which are certainly below 50% of pixar)....
Technicalities are no issue in India at all.. they can easily catch up technically...IMO.. but artistically.. there needs a lot to be done.. traditionally India had stable careers in technical stuff. In my state (A.P.) and certainly in many other states and average student gets 100% in every math exam and calculus is bedtime story here.. so no problem technically... all that is need is that technical people should get into animation field and that needs good counceling and outreach by the existing companies..(I dont see this happening.. sadly..).

all in all.. for all those who are already bored with my long reply and cursing me.. here it is in a nutshell.. I dont know about crest but jadoo is great...it has(atleast Had) talent pool that can rival a US studio.. In India more people need to be assured that animation career is stable and is ample opportunity of a life style... The people must be made aware of the opportunity and more engineers should consider animation as a career direction.. More art colleges should come and animation colleges must be there to crank out the workforce needed.. and last but not least.. I must get a foot hold before the competition gets too tight...;)

chao.. you can curse me as long as you want now... Im done..

backtolive
09-15-2004, 04:42 PM
hi, jnaneshwer

Ha ha! It is very funny that Aghori was asking you how to delete some of his postings. He is the one pronounced that he designed the training material for the people in Bangalore studio. Just imagine such kind of people design training material for animators. The same person also spelt that he was very technically good... learning a software and going through help files does not mean to say that one is technically sound. Anybody could read a chapter on rigging or modeling and get good at it. Unfortunately even though Maya software was installed in the studio that Aghori has been working.. the team leaders saw to that the help documents were not installed on any of the computers. Why? Because any junior animator could go through the documents and get better day-by-day. Keep into account that the help documents were only installed on computers of these team leaders. If juniors sit in the studio from morning to late night- how could they learn other areas of 3D? An animator will remain as animator when he has the potentialities of modeling, lighting or texturing. Neither he could learn new things at work nor can he could try doing new things at his house. Many donít have comps. There was one time when an animator was waiting for the production managers to give him the files so that he could start animating. The files that were supposed to be delivered in the morning were often delivered after three or four in the afternoon. Morning hours were for managers to have meetings. I donít understand what they were talking about. If I try to guess- they must be askingeach other what colour underwear they were wearing or many be they were discussing how to strategically screw up the happiness of fellow human beings. So coming back to the point... this guy was trying to model with polygons and the senior production manager saw him modeling and told him point blank that the animator was hired to animate and not to model. Now the poor animator was having the urge to learn beyond the boundaries that was given to him. I personally feel that he did not do any mistake on his part. A studio should encourage people who have the desire to learn because it benefits the studio by the end of the day. More over he was doing a good job of not wasting time because every wasted minute counts because people are on pay scale. Coming back to poor Aghori... this is my word to you. You might have tried to act very smart with the threads but you did not know that there were smarter guys than you are. You have to get out of the well to see the world of reality. Getting out of the well is a big problem for most of you guys who are the pillars of the studio because you have become comfortable as pouch potatoes. The minute your surrounds sink, you will have to swim out of the water for your life like the rats do when their holes get flooded when it rains. But unfortunately with the ray of hope you will be having, you will not be sinking in water but you will be getting immersed in a quagmire. The outside world is filled with talented people. Welcome to the reality show!! Studios- stop hunting Beyondreamzz, I thing he has done something that is eye-opening to the entire industry. Form now on we should learn to express our views to make the industry a better place. Also when posting message, do not revel who you are, not even to your best friend, not even to your mummy and daddy. I like to use mummy and daddy because most of the pillars team in the Bangalore studio have a mental growth that is equal to a six-year-old. I donít mean their mental growth is like the six-year-old but because these guys never made effort to grow to live up with the competition in the industry. Aghori, if you have anything to express, express donít worry about the restrictions that the studio has imposed on you. Donít even worry if people in your studio have made fun of you by calling you immature. You are the boss of designing the training material, a master who has a good understanding of the technicalities in Maya, the one and only who can bare the weight of the industry, the oxygen in our lungs- ďlierĒ!!! Wait till I skin down every piller, I am starting with Aghori because his Aka name starts with ĎAí In God we trust, Amen. K2

Hope many guys missed this beautiful thread abt your company..... As long as you dont know what happens in other Indian studios and US studios your knowledge goes limited and you end up in wrong conclusions...Thats where your company wins over staff. Its more like life in middle east.. by the time you come back home after 1 year the world would have gone far far ahead and you would have lived some few years back...

and about crest work

chkout
http://www.mikeyoungproductions.com/clips/clips_pa.html
http://www.mikeyoungproductions.com/clips/clips_jakers.html
http://www.mikeyoungproductions.com/clips/clips_olly.html
And i think the last one "olly" was the one about crest was comparing with Nemo... Unfortunately Crest did just pilot for that proj..

chronic_g01
09-15-2004, 07:32 PM
There might be a wide pool of talents in India but still not sure bout the quality yet. They still need a few years more to be as par as Pixar. But by then Pixar standards will already rise. All the best Crest.....

Matt
09-16-2004, 09:45 AM
Hmm... so USA hires programmers from India, India hires animators from USA. Fair trade?
<Snip> <Matt first warning dont go into politics> edit: BAH! That's what this whole thread is about, politics and outsourcing!!!

OOPS! :D

I think that everyone should do their own work. If you invented bread, the people who invented taco shells shouldn't make bread and sell it for cheaper.

Everyone has some special talent or trade that their good at. Every race or country has something that they can do best. Italians and Mexicans have numnumnumy food. Americans have big strong machinery and great ideas. Orientals are good with math and miniturizing. Germans are good at automobiles.

See what I'm saying here?

Not like these issues mean much anyway, the global superstorm is about to hit in a matter of years, as evident by this hurricane season. Jeepers creepers!

slaughters
09-16-2004, 03:18 PM
USA politicians hire mossad agents from Israel to portray Afghani terrorists funded by American and Saudi Arabian elitists to take down two buildings and force a new order on the people of the world in the name of Patriotism.Matt,

I strongly disagree, but CGTalk is supposed to be a non-political non-religious place to discuss 3D and 2D computer graphics. Comments like this just promote flame wars which end up causing threads to be deleted by moderators.

dominicqwek
09-16-2004, 04:33 PM
That's what the media does, they blow things up. Fluff or not, we'll just have to wait and see. Though I am doubtful they are on par on Pixar, it would take them much more time to get to where Pixar is now.

my 2 cents. no pun intended.

d_jnaneswar
09-17-2004, 03:28 PM
hey there backtolive..

looks like you know a lot of people on the inside...i agree with you to a certain extent but i disagree with the quote...(as I said there are hackworkers and there are great people!) I was largely talking about char animation and it rocks in some peoples hands in jadoo..Ive seen it... but as you said ...there surely are people who are in the well.. who need to get out.. and you were correct about the help files not being installed on all systems (I was able to find them on the server tho..;))...neways.. i went through that thread too.. and again... I can agree to certain extent ..but i cant to certain extent cuz ive seen great work... for instance there was this animator who was a drawing teacher before called Gopi... he was just ammazing at drawing...purely ammazing... there are people who are sooo good at animation too..... (besides I dont need to talk for any company per say.. I dont work for any now and am planning to start freelance CG or a handicraft and traditional art studio in Hyd...)

cheers..

Day-Dreamer
09-17-2004, 05:22 PM
chkout
http://www.mikeyoungproductions.com/clips/clips_pa.html
http://www.mikeyoungproductions.com/clips/clips_jakers.html
http://www.mikeyoungproductions.com/clips/clips_olly.html
And i think the last one "olly" was the one about crest was comparing with Nemo... Unfortunately Crest did just pilot for that proj..[/QUOTE]

I think those clips are pretty cool.

maddness
09-17-2004, 07:26 PM
My best response to this is...

http://us.st5.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1811_3982649

friendinlove
09-17-2004, 09:11 PM
I think those clips are pretty cool.
:applause: for US who did pre production and story boarding


Is there someone who can give more info on SFX pipeline in india?

backtolive
09-17-2004, 09:44 PM
hey there backtolive..
looks like you know a lot of people on the inside...
cheers.. I had already mentioned in my earlier posts that all companies has a lot of really talented guys inside... But talent alone is not my subject.. Its about what they can produce if a big work comes from US. Imagine pixar going to give one company in india a big project reading some article abt them..(i know they will never do that).... can you tell me how many of our guys will pass the test??? maximum 100... nothing more than that.. Indian companies boast too much making people in US have a very wrong idea about india. Companies just need work and dollars. they dont care a shit about people inside other than the core 100 and the guys like big a** h**e inside ur company...

Your company need dummies... tats why my frnd didnt got job whereas i got bcoz my frnd had warned me not to act intelligent... people like pandey,pc, vettori are excellent in their stuff... can be even compared to intermediate guys in US.. but what they do is what company asks them to do... not what they can do... even if they want to teach u more, company dont want you to learn more...bcoz u may ask for a raise or you may leave the company... tats what i am personally against. Production guys inside ur company s**ks... and they destroy the companies name... when milk vendors are appointed for operations, you cannot expect "Professionalism" inside... its politics what happens...If they review their own behaviour and try to adopt a better working style... all will get benefit... I am not the person who is going to make money if ur company does well...

There are a lot of guys who have good stuff in india like any other country.. I want them to understand more about what happens abroad in poduction and make people understand... the approach towards future should change in a big way for everyones benefit...

Crest does better job and better projects compared to ur company... but no way they can compare themselves with studios in US... u get more freedom there.. but no life.. they have no consideration for HR... whereas ur company has littlebit abt HR.. crest was dying to recruit guys from jw bcoz they were trained... crest dont even want to take the pain of training guys in their facility...

easy thing to do... think what all changes are required in future, if life should be smooth for all...

Bentagon
09-18-2004, 12:52 PM
Those clips haven't convinced me at all. They're eras away from Pixar quality. Animation is definitly nothing more then "okay". All animation just seems so uninspired and forced. And that underwater scene... I've seen better underwater scenes created by home users (don't ask me for specific links, though). There was so little life in it, it was just a plain boring environment. And then the characters... How can you possible compare those two static sphere-eyed submarines with the life and soul put in Nemo?

Anyways, I do understand it from a publicity point of view. We certainly do know them now, don't we? :p

- Bentagon

bluemagicuk
09-19-2004, 01:06 PM
I would love to see more cultural films coming from india/africa/china wherever , it would
be great to see some unique styles developing, similar to the way manga developed in
the 70's.

andy_maxman
09-20-2004, 09:28 AM
I would love to see more cultural films coming from india/africa/china wherever , it would
be great to see some unique styles developing, similar to the way manga developed in
the 70's.
i believe Peter Parker as Pavitr Prabhakar is under construction...

backtolive
09-22-2004, 08:09 PM
<comment removed by admin>

Thomasphoenix
12-01-2005, 11:47 AM
I've been seeing many such articles out of India in the past 10 yrs,Including the entirely misplaced and misinformed comparisons with "Disney" and now "Pixar".Rest assured that these comparisons are made by people who have no idea what they are talking about.In TV Series animation Indian animation quality is good(still improving),but features !!thats an area thats right now zero! Because people seem to think that a series animation studio can straight go and make a Feature with the same staff.

Maybe with a lot of hard work from fellow artists who feel the work standards here need to improve, in the next 5-ten years there could be a decent indigenous feature feature which will not be a dissappointment internationally, Feature film animation quality wise.(most charlies here dont realise that there is a lot more to feature animation than simulating water or making some cheapo copies of succesful products).

I also think there will be good opportunities for talented CharacterTds(a breed that doesnt exist in India,and very very strangely no one seems to think that could be a problem:D) , Animation Supervisors,Effects Tds to come and work in India albeit for a short while.Education is the problem here and believe me the Artists and Technicians are very keen to learn,Unfortunately they get into the serial production machine and a few years later lose all spirit to improve.

I have worked in this system and fought it tooth and nail ,still fighting! I have not given up!:)! there is always hope!

mummey
12-01-2005, 12:32 PM
http://www.chattablogs.com/quintus/dawn%20zombies.jpg

Yeah.... you get the idea. ;)

orange360
12-01-2005, 04:53 PM
maybe you could import some of those children who work for nike. i hear you can get them for about $8 per day.

pixelmonk
12-01-2005, 05:01 PM
Actually, people hire help. They'll hire the cheapest, fastest help anytime, regardless of country (and sometimes even regardless of quality).

one of the reasons why companies who were relying out outsourcing from countries like India are seeking other ways to meet their outsourcing needs as their current plans are failing due to lackluster customer support from these outsourcing sweat shops.

slaughters
12-01-2005, 05:06 PM
Original Post: 12-16-2003 - Like mummey said - Dawn of the Dead time

But, I did run accross a web article about an India animated film that looks pretty unique to me:

Hanuman, (the 2D animated Indian feature made completely in India directed by an Indian and animated by Indian artists with an Indian super hero as its subject and lead)

http://www.indiantelevision.com/anex/y2k5/headlines/anex342.htm

agreenster
12-01-2005, 06:09 PM
How do these 2 year old threads come back to life like this?

FloydBishop
12-01-2005, 06:41 PM
How do these 2 year old threads come back to life like this?

You're supposed to do a search for a topic rather than starting a new thread when you want to discuss something. Maybe that's why it was revived?

Anyway, the new film "Hoodwinked" will show if an outsourced film done with a small budget will bring in big numbers at the box office. If it does, be prepared for the floodgates to open. Why do one film for $60 million when you can do six of them?

send2raj
12-02-2005, 05:16 AM
Original Post: 12-16-2003 -
But, I did run accross a web article about an India animated film that looks pretty unique to me:

Hanuman, (the 2D animated Indian feature made completely in India directed by an Indian and animated by Indian artists with an Indian super hero as its subject and lead)

http://www.indiantelevision.com/anex/y2k5/headlines/anex342.htm

What you have read quite true and it's india's first successful animated movie :thumbsup: .
More on dat check this link http://www.hanuman-thefilm.com/

Marcel
12-02-2005, 08:56 AM
http://www.chattablogs.com/quintus/dawn%20zombies.jpg

Yeah.... you get the idea. ;)

What, you mean zombies always have healthy looking bellies no matter what their face looks?

rawskull
12-02-2005, 10:32 AM
i believe Peter Parker as Pavitr Prabhakar is under construction...

i think our friend here ment original content not what would it be like having spider mean in "dothi" and he becomes a culturally original :)

also it is sad that most of the so called big guys giving bold statments and claiming to have reached pinnacle still think deep down high speed machines and better softwares can save the day.

hope the big guys just shut up and show how good they are before concidering to give an interview.

sciics
12-02-2005, 12:25 PM
QUOTE _____our software are ahead of even what some studios in the US use. Jakers! The Adventures Of Piggley Winks was developed using a software called XSI, which was made by Soft Image. It is the industry's first truly non-linear animation (NLA) system for the film, commercial/broadcast and games markets.
-------QUOTE

they actully won an award at the BAFTA sometime back....
http://www.bafta.org/site/page133.html

also nomainated was the adventures of Jack Frost wich again was done in one of the animation studios in India.

Lunatique
12-03-2005, 02:28 AM
Don't these Indian companies have media correspondent/publicists? Don't they research on the negative reactions to these ludicrous claims they have been making in the past years? Don't they know how it makes them look to the rest of the world? Aren't they concerned about their reputation?

isoparmB
12-05-2005, 06:10 AM
You're supposed to do a search for a topic rather than starting a new thread when you want to discuss something. Maybe that's why it was revived?

Anyway, the new film "Hoodwinked" will show if an outsourced film done with a small budget will bring in big numbers at the box office. If it does, be prepared for the floodgates to open. Why do one film for $60 million when you can do six of them?

We're hoping it will. Of course, money is just one factor in the equation. The crew and their leadership have to be up to the challenge.

I think india will do well in cg, they already have a head start. The leadership there should just be receptive to the needs of cg prod. The manpower potential there is immense, all they need is to foster a culture of developing their people's skills. It won't do to keep your animators just as animators.

pichoo
12-05-2005, 10:40 AM
You're supposed to do a search for a topic rather than starting a new thread when you want to discuss something. Maybe that's why it was revived?

Anyway, the new film "Hoodwinked" will show if an outsourced film done with a small budget will bring in big numbers at the box office. If it does, be prepared for the floodgates to open. Why do one film for $60 million when you can do six of them?

I just saw the trailers of hoodwinked, most of the animations is really embarrasing.

I'd rather watched one kicked ass movie than 6 louzy ones :) but that's me, and I'm being honest here. I search for quality than quantity, not sure about the rest of the world.

hanskloss
12-05-2005, 02:36 PM
That is a very funny interview. If they are going to work in a similar fashion as they do in the automotive field than their animation future is as bleak as the future of GM. I have a number of friends working for the automotive companies which send a lot of their contracts to India. Not only do they screw up the projects royally 95% of the time but they deliver late 95% of the time. Good luck. Cheap doesn't always mean better. And them comparing themselves to Pixar is just the joke of the year.

Manish
12-07-2005, 03:13 AM
I know they are one of the good ones in India. Does anyone has some links to animations done by this studio! Just curious.

Manish

opus13
12-07-2005, 03:49 AM
I just saw the trailers of hoodwinked, most of the animations is really embarrasing.

holy crap you werent kidding.

One small step for man, one giant leap backward for for artkind.

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