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nemirc
12-16-2003, 06:29 AM
Hullo everybody.

This is my first post here and I really want to know if this evocates any kind of emotion.

http://www.digital-opaque.net/work/wip/despair.jpg

I am currently working on my "character in repose" entry for EXPOSÉ and I'd like to know if the emotion is strong enough.

C&C welcome :)

EDIT: Sorry for the rez. I decided to post a lowrez image instead of the full 3600px one. Besides the "artifacts" they are virtually identical.

boboroshi
12-17-2003, 12:13 AM
I like the modeling, the pose, and the environment (althought i think you could work some more on the environment in the foreground). Is that a steel bar coming out of the concrete?

I think some volumetric light or a different kind of lighting might help this out a lot to be more evocative.

Is there anything that you can give a clue as to the reason for the blood on the floor? Why the despair? etc?

Garma
12-17-2003, 12:17 AM
you are off to a good picture but change a few things

- change the texture of the wings. try make the bones almost black and maybe add some translucency to the parts between those bones. I'm sorry but it looks like a quick job this way. Make the bump less strong.

- did you use poser? The pose itself is really good but I see a strange deformation near her right leg.

(sigh) I wrote quit a story about the lighting and then I realised my brightness was way too high up :( argh. Now the texture of the wings isn't visible anymore. I'd still change it though. One point is left from my lighting advices. the light on the girl from the right, lower the intensity. She doesn't match her environment right now. ALso change the sky, with that sky the viewer would be able to see a lot more coz the sun would be higher.

good luck!

boboroshi
12-17-2003, 12:31 AM
Maybe add rain as well?

now that i look at it, there's an odd crease on the right leg at the hip (while you're fixing the knee)...

nemirc
12-17-2003, 01:05 AM
Well, not exactly a complete redux but more like an experiment.

Today I brought it into combustion and then I just played around with some filters (not an "oops I did it again" kind of thing since I already knew what I was doing) and I came to this.

http://www.digital-opaque.net/flash/stills/2003/despair.jpg
Just trying to make it look "different".

As for the bood I thought I could add some blood coming out of bruises and stuff like that but then I was like "eeeeerrrrrrr.... too much blood... not a good thing".

I think I could make that "translucency" on the wings but I don't know how to do it and still mantain the "realism" (I am affraid that would make them look more like semi-transparent wings).
I took that idea from a screen cap from "Reign of Fire" (although photorealistic organic sufraces are far beyond my shading skills).

jawine
12-18-2003, 10:55 AM
The way I 'read' the picture is that she is despaired because of the wings coming out of her, which look like demon wings. But that's just a guess, because it's not clear why she is despaired, maybe it's not the wings but she just did something awful.

If you want to make it a bit more evocative, maybe it's a good idea to share your story behind this picture and then it's much easier to suggest improvement for the evocative part :)

Garma
12-18-2003, 11:10 AM
I don't think artists should share their stories too easy. I think it's better to let the viewer think about it. To me it's pretty clear the wings make her despair. You know, not being able to be among normal people because of evil demon wings can make one quite desperate.

The fact that she's lighted from the right still disturbs me. Also try to fix the deformation errors near the hip and the knee. I also would lower the reflectivity of the steel coming out of the concrete, make it rusty.

boboroshi
12-18-2003, 01:59 PM
I'd say that if the wings had just sprung out of her, they'd need to look young, so fresh, new, covered in mucus, lighter color, etc.

I agree withGarma. the lighting has got to get fixed.

nemirc
12-18-2003, 02:45 PM
Originally posted by Garma
I don't think artists should share their stories too easy. I think it's better to let the viewer think about it. To me it's pretty clear the wings make her despair. You know, not being able to be among normal people because of evil demon wings can make one quite desperate.

The fact that she's lighted from the right still disturbs me. Also try to fix the deformation errors near the hip and the knee. I also would lower the reflectivity of the steel coming out of the concrete, make it rusty.

Answering both jawine and Garma at the same time.

I sort of wanted the viewer to answer that question by themselves. After all, every time we see a picture, a painting or anything that represents "art" in some "viewable" (don't know if that word is correct) way we are not told the story underneath it.

For me, it's related to certain recent events which I will not utter here. It's like she is unraveiing and she doesn't fully like what she is becoming.

That's pretty much it ^_^

BTW, what do you exactly mean by "the lighting has to be fixed"? O_o

boboroshi
12-18-2003, 02:59 PM
I think the main thing holding this shot back right now is the original lighting. What is the light source on the right hand side?

I would remove it completely and start with a volumetric light from the broken wall. (maybe volumetric would be too strong) but one source.

I'd also make the wings look young - as if they just popped out of her.

The shot's great, but i think those two things can really take it up to the level you're trying to match for Exposé.

nemirc
12-18-2003, 03:17 PM
The frontal light was setup so the woman could be "seen" (I tried a backlit setup but I couldn't see a damn thing).
Nevertheless I could decrease the amount of light on the front.

I will also make a better shader for the wings (less bump and maybe make them look wet or something?). Someone said they blend too much with the background so I am going to change the color also.
Also some rust on the tubes... maybe?

We will see.

boboroshi
12-18-2003, 03:21 PM
If the tubes are supposed to be reinforing bars in the concrete, do some searching for steel rebar. it's generally smaller and more mesh like, which could also give you more destruction/wreckage.

I'd say wet wings with some mucus on them would make them look more "hatched".

Looking forward to the tweaks! :)

Randuin
12-19-2003, 01:04 AM
I'm interested in alot of the wierd deformations in the model and some artifacts... May be you should weight out the verts/tweak the model to perfection before you try to make it into a scene?

jawine
12-21-2003, 06:06 PM
It was just a suggestion to share the story it helps some people you see ;)

Uhm just an idea: the wings come out of the body pretty smoothly, maybe you could make them tear out of the body, or in other ways give the idea of 'growing pains'

The material of the wings isn't in any way related to the skin of the female, maybe you wanted it that way, but to me it gives the suggestion they are a bit put on, instead of part of her. In animals the skin/fur are pretty consistent over the body, and more consistency might help the design. Again just a suggestion ^0^

Drakaran
01-11-2004, 08:32 AM
right now, it looks like the bump on the wings is the same as on the wall/crete. I'd change that to bring more focus to them. in fact, I would say the focus is on the woman when it should be on the wings. the woman needs dirt and grime as well as cuts and stuff. she's too clean. if she's loosing herself, her humainty, you need to make this more clear symbolically with how she looks. maybe spread a bit of scaling on her back to show her being taken over/loosing herself.... and in her extremeties, like her toes and fingers blackening and turning/twisting.....

and get rid of the tan line on the hip, it draws attention to that point for no reason.

looking pretty good.. not much technically wrong with it. Evoc is a good idea to get the polish on this piece. it's quite good.

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