speeding up LW ?

[sebek27]

no one ? does a better video card speed up the viewport ? and more memory/cpu for rendering ? but i still want to know if there is any speed tips without upgrading thx

[wgreenlee1]

i dunno...but i hear ya on the opengl probs...:hmm:


what card and proc do you have right now?

[SheepFactory]

I NEVER have any slowdowns in maya , you should try maya!

[leigh]

Originally posted by sebek27
I noticed that LW import/export filter is really bad.. I can import any type of file into Cinema and Cinema viewport display and rendering is soo much faster.

Then use Cinema.

[Pi3141]

Well firstly whats the polycount of the model?

Secondly whats your render subpatch level set at? Take it down to 3 or 4.

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by Sheep Factory
I NEVER have any slowdowns in maya , you should try maya!



lol...............lmao

[ThE_JacO]

you can genlock 2 boxes with 2 quadro FX3000G (and I mean pipe sync, not simple signal sync)
I'd suggest you upgrade to a cluster of 2 quad opterons with genlocked FX3000G.

with some luck incarceration because of debt will rid us of these kind of questions.

my apologies to the LW forum users for my spamming, I don't usually haunt this board, but this was soooo called for.

[LittleFenris]

Originally posted by Sheep Factory
I NEVER have any slowdowns in maya , you should try maya!

Not sure everyone has $6000 for a 3D program like you. :rolleyes:

Is sure seems like you Maya guys just come in here and talk crap about Lightwave and other programs like they are inferior. One more reason I don't use Maya...its wonderful community. :surprised

[Sil3]

Dont let them full you with Maya sebek27, Houdini all the way oh yeah :buttrock: :buttrock: :buttrock:

[Recursive]

yeah, maya is fast at this shit

[leigh]

I hear that pencil and paper has no speed problems at all.

[Per-Anders]

vwtornado, actually it's only $1999, (unless you want some unnecesary things for beginner users such as maya fur, cloth and fluids) maya :buttrock: i'd say give maya a whirl sebek, it rocks.

[sebek27]

i don't want to use cinema (for now), i'm using LW and that's what I want to use :)

and i don't like Maya

[chrisdude0000]

I was using maya over the summer and some of this school year so maybe about 4 to 5 months saw some stuff on lightwave bought it without using it and just got it a few days ago and like lightwave alot more.

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by Leigh
I hear that pencil and paper has no speed problems at all.

chalk boards put a whoopin on those tho.....lol

[ThE_JacO]

the problem must be because there are too many Npolys.
go back to cinema (you just bought it anyway, didn't you) and that's solved

[sebek27]

i like LW modeling tools better than cinemas, right now i just want to know how to speed up the viewport/rendering in LW

[leigh]

You haven't even mentioned what the poly count on the car is, so it's not really possible to give you any idea of why you are experiencing slow speed in your viewports.

Secondly if you "like LW modeling tools", then why are you downloading free models instead of making your own? Honestly, you can't compare modelling tools if you aren't even making your own models ;)

At the end of the day, you should ideally always make sure you are running decent hardware. Obviously a display card with more memory speeds up your display, why do you even ask that?

I'm sorry to say this Sebek, but in all honesty I often get the feeling that you post things without even thinking them through first :shrug:

[Pi3141]

Sebek, work with me here, I'm trying to help you out.

right now i just want to know how to speed up the viewport/rendering in LW


Firstly too many people would prefer to blame the LW render engine, than to to actually take the time to optimize their scenes.

What lighting setup are you using? What does the scene look like your trying to render? Does the lighting setup justitfy and suit the scene trying to be rendered? Too many people also overkill their scenes with options turned on that will have no effect on that particular scene. This of course adds alot to render time and is not needed.

Showing us what you are trying to resolve would greatly aid in your own assistance.


As with the modeling, What is the polygon count of the model you downloaded? What is your subpatch setting on in modeler? What graphics card are you using and what are your PC specs?


Providing all this infomation would greatly help with gettings your issues sorted out, which I beleive was the original reason this thread was started?

[sebek27]

basically i downloaded a free car scene from turbosquid so I can see how the lighting/textures are setup. And I noticed that it is very slow when I rotate the car around in Modeler even when subpatch is off and in cinema it's much faster so i was just trying to find out what other things will speed up viewport configuration. I downloaded this free scene so i can study how he setup the lighting / textures it's the Ford file on turbosquid

[Pi3141]

Ok fantastic, you answered none of my questions so I'm afraid i can't help you out there.

Good Luck!




:surprised

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by wgreenlee1
i dunno...but i hear ya on the opengl probs...:hmm:


what card and proc do you have right now?



:hmm: :rolleyes:

[sebek27]

i'm sorry i'm at work so I don't have LW running, I will give you the scene specs when I get home THX !

my pc:
AMD Athlon XP 1700+, Nvidia GeForce 3 TI 200 64mb Ram (latest nvidia drivers) 768mb DDR ram 80gb hard drive, and LW 7.5

[sebek27]

Pi3141 - when i wrote my post, you're writing wasn't there till after i submitted sorry

[Pi3141]

Oh ok, I just had noticed other people had asked spec related questions, including myself on the first page

I assumed your lack of answers to my most recent post was somthing of the same nature. My mistake for assuming. I apologise :beer:

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by sebek27
i'm sorry i'm at work so I don't have LW running, I will give you the scene specs when I get home THX !

my pc:
AMD Athlon XP 1700+, Nvidia GeForce 3 TI 200 64mb Ram (latest nvidia drivers) 768mb DDR ram 80gb hard drive, and LW 7.5

is ur machine clean?
is ur temp files dumped?
do you defrag/scan disk?
do you have a bunch of background crap running?
what OS are you running,if its XP then go to a XP users site and learn how to tame it a little

all of these wear on ur processor when ur dealing in 3D
ttake care of these first
i havent run C4D in a very long time so i cant say but im think ur going to be let down caparing these two...and withthat i think i better make for the door.....lol

[sebek27]

windows 2000 PRO SP3, hard drive is clean, temp files are out
i will post the file specs when i get home

[projectcoil]

Hit 'o' in modeler and turn patch divisions down a notch.

[Keddy]

Hit 'o' general option and set the Patch Divison to 1 then you can rotates it so smooth. If you want high polygon or save it, so you should set the patch divison to 6 or high before save it.

oh projectcoil beat me to it :)

[sebek27]

here are the file specs:
Geometry: NURBS
Polygons: 518,936
Vertices: 399,144
Animated model: No
Textures included: Yes
Materials included: Yes
Jointed model: No

and i have patch set to 1 in modeler
loaded only the car into modeler

http://www.pixeloxygen.com/images/stats.jpg

[kevman3d]

Some tips for optimising speed in Modeler.

Split your car into layers - Like rip its wheels off and chuck them into another layer - Then just work on the layer you need - ie. Less polys, faster view port refreshing

Turn OFF cages and guides - These surprisingly slow things down more then expected if they are on.

Weightshade view is a lot slower to draw then most others

Solid views tend to redraw faster then wrieframe cause they cull the backfaces (try these for orthographic viewports). But then you can't easily select your backfaces.

Switch to a single view port if you're just viewing the model. Its less intensive then updating all 4.

Shrink the modeler window down as small as possible on the desktop. Smaller viewport to redraw is a little faster.

Just some tips from me... Hope something there helps?

[wgreenlee1]

Polygons: 518,936


well theres the prob....but ta...youre saying C4D will let you spin that around freely to examine it?
i heard it(C4D) loves the poly counts like XSI but thats what my old rig wouldve done with 500k of polys...it would spit and sputtered

what does it do when its in C4D?

[sebek27]

well in cinema when set to lowest setting, it's nice and smooth when rotating the car

[telamon]

What is the reason why an initial 500 k object polys become "only" 60 k polys in LW ?

I don't understand why there are also 60 k parts and 60 k cols.

There is probably an import issue behind that.

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by sebek27
well in cinema when set to lowest setting, it's nice and smooth when rotating the car


oh?

hmmmmm...well i heard C4D could handle the polys....i might have to get the demo and check it for meself....
i dunno what to tell you now.....telemon might have have something there...maybe

[sebek27]

maybe the stats the person posted on turbosquid are off who knows
wgreenlee1: try the demo, it's the easiest 3d app I have ever used, most intuitive, fastest rendering engine can't wait to see what cinema 9 will have up it's sleeve.. but for now I need to focus on LW and read Essentials when it comes in next week

[Keddy]

Originally posted by telamon
What is the reason why an initial 500 k object polys become "only" 60 k polys in LW ?

I don't understand why there are also 60 k parts and 60 k cols.

There is probably an import issue behind that.

500k is freezing subpatch in Layout. 60k is not freeze subpatch yet in Modeler.

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by sebek27
maybe the stats the person posted on turbosquid are off who knows
wgreenlee1: try the demo, it's the easiest 3d app I have ever used, most intuitive, fastest rendering engine can't wait to see what cinema 9 will have up it's sleeve.. but for now I need to focus on LW and read Essentials when it comes in next week

ok...yeah im thinking about switching....im fed up with maya anyways...just isnt up to par,i need something you can make full thearical releases with,ya know? ;)

[telamon]

Originally posted by Keddy
500k is freezing subpatch in Layout. 60k is not freeze subpatch yet in Modeler.

I made a quick calculation

518936/62494 = 8.3

It is not a subpatch ratio i.e. 4, 9, 16...

[Castius]

Look up simple wireframe edges and simple wireframe points. they are options in lw to help speed things up on lower systems.

under display also take a look at all the item set to visibility. Each one of these will slow the display down. So make your upper right viewport independent and just show the surface. Then read your manual some ore and see how you can set that as a preset.

I have almost the identical system as you and 65k poly moves ok in modeler. It could be faster but nothing to loose sleep over. What you need to see in C4d is how easily you can manipulate the mesh. you can see LW opengl is much faster by just loading the mesh in layout and rotate around. Layouts opengl can be a lot faster cause it has less to display. If it's sub-d set the display steps to 0.

Things are not always as strait forward as they can appear.

[Krix]

Hi Sebek,

Just downloaded the car. I guess the main reason the slowdown of modeler is that basically all layers are open when you load this object. And the car seperated to 41 (or something) layers. This layer setup is for modelling when you obviously don't keep all the layers open just those what you need. If you don't want to modify the object I suggest to merge all the layers into one and save it as a different file. As kevman3d said: also keep in mind the differnces between the OGL shadings. For example wireframe, wireframe shade needs more calculation than a flat shade view. This is more noticable with high detailed object though. If guides visibility on you can turn it off too decrease the amount of point what your video hardware has to transform.

I hope it helps.

Cheers,
Krix

[LittleFenris]

Originally posted by mdme_sadie
(unless you want some unnecesary things for beginner users such as maya fur, cloth and fluids)

You mean things that come with Lightwave? Wow, I can spend more on Maya and have less features!! woo hoo!! :applause: :rolleyes:

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by VWTornado
You mean things that come with Lightwave? Wow, I can spend more on Maya and have less features!! woo hoo!! :applause: :rolleyes:

ok...we're gettin off target here
the thing i heard about C4D compared to LW is this:it handle large files better,it renders them faster(not better or whatever else)but it handles those polys better...now im not sure if its the openGL or what that sebek is having probs with

one thing u might look at is the drivers sebek
i know the newer drivers(54.04 or whatever)dont run as good in maya asthe older ones(45.03 or whatever they are) so that might be something else to look at....i dunno:shrug:

[sebek27]

thx for all the input everybody, i turned off some things and in flat shade it's moving quickly enough now ! in layout it's faster also than in modeler

[CIM]

Originally posted by VWTornado
You mean things that come with Lightwave? Wow, I can spend more on Maya and have less features!! woo hoo!! :applause: :rolleyes:

There sure are alot of totally clueless ppl. in this forum. :rolleyes:

[Nemoid]

Hey ! what happens? CIM has changed his avatar in smth funnier!! :buttrock: (don't take it personal, CIM its not sarcasm)

and he's also right when he says about Maya. really features in unlimited regarding fur and fluids are kick ass!! Lw has saslite, particles and hypervoxels, but Maya features in these fields are surely deeper even if they require some more work from the user.
every app have its own good (and bad) characteristics.

regarding Lw, i liked the advices to speed up things in modeler. actually i work quite always without guides, normals and things like that on, and I use them when strictly necessary and useful. another thing wich can be helpful is setting well the memory level used by Lw in Layout options, and in Modeler use also the hide selection to view huge models in parts. in the case of the car viewing it layer by layer can be very helpful too.

[LittleFenris]

Originally posted by CIM
There sure are alot of totally clueless ppl. in this forum. :rolleyes:

There sure are. :rolleyes: I have played with Maya 4.5 Unlimited, C4D8, 3DS Max 5, XSI, and of course I own LW 7.5. I am by no means clueless. The dynamics, cloth, fur and fluids in Maya Unlimited are quite easy to use, and very powerful, but it also costs you $4500 more than Lightwave for those features (admitedly the Maya features are more robust, but at a huge cost). A good user can make Lightwave do the same stuff as Maya, even if it involves tricks to make it work. :wip:

[tOd]

Originally posted by VWTornado
A good user can make Lightwave do the same stuff as Maya, even if it involves tricks to make it work. :wip:


LOL Thanks for the laugh.

[Nemoid]

Originally posted by VWTornado
A good user can make Lightwave do the same stuff as Maya, even if it involves tricks to make it work. :wip:

Very true. always is true in every app that the user makes the difference. :)

[sebek27]

i'm thinking about ordering PlugPak V2.1 for LW7.5, how do i know if it will work in LW 8 ?? should i buy any plugins not really knowing if they will work in 8 ? thx

[leigh]

Sebek27, you should learn to use LightWave's native tools before getting plugins. Getting plugins now will only cause them to become a crutch in future.

Seriously, spend at least a few weeks learning LW thoroughly. Don't go spending money on plugins when you don't even know what LW offers ;)

[Rabid pitbull]

Originally posted by Leigh
I'm sorry to say this Sebek, but in all honesty I often get the feeling that you post things without even thinking them through first :shrug:

I tend to agree with Leigh.....

[sebek27]

thanks for the answer :D

[Per-Anders]

Originally posted by VWTornado
There sure are. :rolleyes: I have played with Maya 4.5 Unlimited, C4D8, 3DS Max 5, XSI, and of course I own LW 7.5. I am by no means clueless. The dynamics, cloth, fur and fluids in Maya Unlimited are quite easy to use, and very powerful, but it also costs you $4500 more than Lightwave for those features (admitedly the Maya features are more robust, but at a huge cost). A good user can make Lightwave do the same stuff as Maya, even if it involves tricks to make it work. :wip:

i would have to disagree here and dispell a few rumours. maya dynamics firstly do not cost an additional $4500, they're in the base package, yes that's softbodies and rigid bodies.

in complete what you wont get is
1) fluids (this is not the same as particle based fluid simulation), there is no equivalent to this in lightwave, certain fluid effects can be mimicked using hypervoxels voxels and particles if you know how.
2) fur, saslite does not compare on any level with maya fur, it's as big a difference as between saslite and full sasquatch, however consider you can also by joseph alters "Shave & Haircut" plugin for maya, so all in all you have the same deal with regards hair, especially when you consider the inbuilt paintfx system which is available on all versions of maya.
3) Cloth - motion designer is only the equivalent of softbodies in maya, not the same as maya cloth. softbodies are available in the complete package (and also run in realtime for most situations).
4) a bunch of other stuff including Maya Live etc which again aren't things readily available from within teh vanilla LW package.

[CIM]

Originally posted by VWTornado
There sure are. :rolleyes: I have played with Maya 4.5 Unlimited, C4D8, 3DS Max 5, XSI, and of course I own LW 7.5. I am by no means clueless. The dynamics, cloth, fur and fluids in Maya Unlimited are quite easy to use, and very powerful, but it also costs you $4500 more than Lightwave for those features (admitedly the Maya features are more robust, but at a huge cost). A good user can make Lightwave do the same stuff as Maya, even if it involves tricks to make it work. :wip:

Well, you clearly have no clue about what features Maya (really) has, so that would make you clueless, wouldn't it?

Forget Maya Unlimited, just compare Maya Complete ($1,999), which is only a few hundred more than LightWave. Show me where LightWave has this:

- NURBS
- Paint Effects
- Artisan sculpting tools
- 3D painting tools
- Node-based shader system
- World-class renderer (mental ray)
- Vector or hardware renders
- Hierarchical subdivsion surfaces
- Robust programming language and SDK

I could keep going on, but I think I made my point. :)

[Cman]

Originally posted by sebek27
try the demo, [C4D is] the easiest 3d app I have ever used, most intuitive, fastest rendering engine can't wait to see what cinema 9 will have up it's sleeve.. but for now I need to focus on LW and read Essentials when it comes in next week

Seriously, if you believe this then you should quit LW while you're ahead and jump into C4D.
Why learn a program you already think is less intuitive, slower and not exciting to you?

[sebek27]

because, many companies here use LW and actually one offered me a job, not doing LW but web design/animation where I could have jumped into LW in the future; I do websites on the side for my freelance work and now I want to also learn 3D

[CGmonkey]

But sebek.. Who would offer YOU a job?

[sebek27]

and you are ?? i already have a full time job, get paid well but I don't do design work there; who would offer me a job ? right out of school I got a job at a prestigious design company beating out 40 other people - web designer position. I also worked for a smaller company designing websites, and a few months back the company that uses LW and Flash for animations offered me a job where i beat out 20 other candidates - this was once again, for flash/web work not 3D; so those are the companies that offered me a job :p by the way, your website won't even load

[CGmonkey]

Still.. the question...

Anyway.. I kinda know my website won't load and part of that is because I have no website!

[wgreenlee1]

Originally posted by CIM
Well, you clearly have no clue about what features Maya (really) has, so that would make you clueless, wouldn't it?

Forget Maya Unlimited, just compare Maya Complete ($1,999), which is only a few hundred more than LightWave. Show me where LightWave has this:

- NURBS
- Paint Effects
- Artisan sculpting tools
- 3D painting tools
- Node-based shader system
- World-class renderer (mental ray)
- Vector or hardware renders
- Hierarchical subdivsion surfaces
- Robust programming language and SDK

I could keep going on, but I think I made my point. :)




paint affects alone is worth the upgrade price
heck theyre even beggin for it in the newtek forums....lol

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15060

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