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toddler
12-10-2003, 09:04 AM
First, you all amaze me.../me looks around in awe....

Second, I am virtually a complete newbie. I had LW 5 for a while, due to work and my new pc only having a usb port,(no paralell (sigh)). My wife bought me LW 7.5 this week.

And, happily enough, I have someone who wants some work done. For not a lot of cash, but thats really beside the point.

The problem: I know a lot of the theory. I have the tools, (lw 7.5, painter 8, photoshop 6-CS, Poser 5(which I don't like at all I might add), and a few other odds and ends). I look at work by folks like SplineGod and sigh(a lot). Okay, the problem: My client would like a scene:

"I want a dragon, recently killed by a Valkrye holding a sword and wearing armor....oh, there needs to be a cat in there as well, preferably nibbling on the carcass of the still bleeding dragon."

okay, cool. well, except for the cat part. It just doesn't seem to fit if you know what i mean. So the user wants this.

I figured, sure thing! I open up poser, grab a stock model, pose, export as wavefront, import into modeler...oh wow, thats a lot of polys. how am I going to put hair on her? or better, Armor? (plate, not chain. maybe banded, dunno). Hmmm....ok, shelve that because its probably going to be 'easier' to model from scratch then use poser. (how would you animate a poser model in LW? still scratching my head over that one, though I assume you would export 'spread eagled' and bone from there)

The dragon. Wow. Firstly, magic bevel is very cool. I sat for under a minute just playing and came up with something 'cool' (not DONE, but cool( http://wystuff.com/gallery/toddler/squiddie_1
))

I don't even know if I have a specific question. I suppose a 'where should i go first?' would do.

I guess I should start with: i get some of the basics of both box modelling and not at all spline modelling. (are there 2 l's in modelling? :)) Texturing I can do okay, I have a semi decent experience in 2d(hence most of the tools), plus my wife is GD major.

(and build websites, and unix sysadmin, and and and ... hello board...)


Any pointers appreciated, I will try to answer specific questions as best I can.
SplineGod
12-10-2003, 10:15 AM
LOL! Thanks but believe me I did a lot of sighing when I started out too. If you look at the big picture too long it can become overwhelming.
Start with some sketches. Does your client have some general idea first or leaving it up to you?
Rough out some ideas and see what your client likes best.
Draw up a dragon, scan it in and use it as the basis for your model. The important thing is to preplan on paper what you plan to do.
I have a very simple spline tutorial that shows how to use splines to rough out a reptile head. I would probably use splines to quickly rough out the body as well. Another approach which isnt too bad is to box model. Heres an example based on using an image of a cheetah as a background reference. You can easily rough out the body in a short time. Just work methodically and keep it as clean as you can. :)
http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/cheetah_process.jpg
tsu3000
12-10-2003, 10:39 AM
Very impressive SplineGod!:applause:
SplineGod
12-10-2003, 10:43 AM
Thanks tsu, :)
I think if toddler has a nice clean pic of a dragon it shouldnt be too difficult to apply the same technique to get the body, neck and tail. :)
I forgot! I also have the body uploaded. Each stage you see in the picture are in different layers. You can get it HERE (http://www.3dtrainingonline.com/examples/Cheetah.zip)
leigh
12-10-2003, 12:26 PM
Woahhh, as a virtual beginner, I think you've really just landed yourself in the deep end...

Good luck.... The valkyrie should be easy to do (characters are generally quick, and if it's going to be wearing platemail, then you can ignore a lot of the base anatomy ;)), but dragons are another story altogether. I'd recommend starting off with something basic and reptilian and then simply altering it to become dragon-like. The problem is that there are sooo many different kinds of dragons.
kevb3d
12-10-2003, 03:56 PM
You did land yourself in the deep end. Also, that's a ton of work for the money if you're using 3D. If it doesn't need to be animated, why not just paint it? Do a few concept sketches and make any changes at that stage. Then, when you have the green light from your client, paint it. Use Photoshop layers so you can color correct later if need be.

SplineGod, I love your style. I just can't ever seem to get splines to work right in Lightwave, but one day....oh yes...one day I will LOL!

Kevin
chrisWhite
12-10-2003, 06:06 PM
Well, I'm not a big Poser fan, but like so many I did start out with it. If your client is cool with you using poser I would go with one of the Poser dragons, in my day this was my favorite:

Curio's Majestic Dragon (http://www.fusiondesignuk.com/majestic/news.html)

The DAZ Millennium Dragon (http://secure.daz3d.com/shop.php?op=itemdetails&item=846) was and probably still is very popular as well.

Granted these aren't free so you may not have the budget for these, but if you do they might be a life savor as a dragon would be pretty hard for someone new to Lightwave.
projectcoil
12-10-2003, 09:27 PM
LOL. Your client share the exact same tastes as I do. :)
I think my WIP dragon, cheetah, and soon to be female knight is around here somewhere.

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=93812&highlight=cheetah
Pi3141
12-10-2003, 09:32 PM
Wow, you have landed in the crap lol.

Contact me over ICQ, I'll help you with this one, we'll see if we can get that dragon sorted out.

:beer:
toddler
12-10-2003, 10:06 PM
thanks folks! SplineGod: you have me sighing again....

I _could_ paint it and call it good, but I really want to
hone the 3D side of my skills. And, well, I have a month
and half to get something to him, so it should be doable.

I've started sketching the base geometry, its rather dificult
to find a 'good' 2d dragon that has proper scale(ha), I think
I need to run to the bookstore and grab some D&D books. My
client had first asked for a Tiamat multiheaded dragon, which would have been even more amusing...


Indeed, the deep end. But, as I'm fond of telling my junior sysadmin types, learning by fire is the best way to learn, so long as you have good mentors. (that would be ya'll...:))

thanks again, will put up some WIP's when I get a moment or 2, Sadly I have a 'real job' which requires me to work some fairly off hours.

thanks again folks, will keep updated...
toddler
12-10-2003, 10:46 PM
Will ICQ when I figure out what my old pw is/was....:)
SplineGod
12-11-2003, 01:54 AM
Hey Toddler,
I know Pisongs helping you with some stuff. Just wanted to let you know that if you still need help send me an icq. :)
toddler
12-11-2003, 02:18 AM
I truly appreciate the help and offers of help from you folks. Certainly a stellar community!
Petrik
12-11-2003, 03:48 AM
Wow cool. Everyone is offering to help. Must remember that when I get my first big project. Will you guys all be wanting a slice of the profits as well (will need to budget that into the costing)?

I love this Lightwave community. I wish the real world was more like this. I'm trying to find work right now and everyone is so protective of everything. You're offering to work for them and they get all FBI with you like you're after the companies trade secrets or something.

Top marks to Pisong and splinegod for coming to the rescue. I'd offer a hand in as well but these guys are way ahead of me so you'll be in great hands there.

If the job allows please keep us informed with updates on the progress. I'd love to see how this develops.

A huge :thumbsup: to the community you guys never fail to amaze me.
toddler
12-11-2003, 04:31 AM
Originally posted by Petrik
Wow cool. Everyone is offering to help. Must remember that when I get my first big project. Will you guys all be wanting a slice of the profits as well (will need to budget that into the costing)?

I love this Lightwave community. I wish the real world was more like this. I'm trying to find work right now and everyone is so protective of everything. You're offering to work for them and they get all FBI with you like you're after the companies trade secrets or something.

Top marks to Pisong and splinegod for coming to the rescue. I'd offer a hand in as well but these guys are way ahead of me so you'll be in great hands there.

If the job allows please keep us informed with updates on the progress. I'd love to see how this develops.

A huge :thumbsup: to the community you guys never fail to amaze me.

I'm going to borrow that line btw, 'they went all FBI on me!'

I'll keep folks up to date, will be staring at the images above the SG posted and trying to make my little mouse do the right thing in the right order.

My fee for this particular job is VERY minimal, but thats cool. I don't do straight work for hire much, I like to own my images...
Insider
12-11-2003, 05:44 AM
Best of luck with it -
if you can, get a model of a cat vs. building one to save time and money. I think you mentioned Poser - Poser is great for working with models in LW - just export out an OBJ. You may want to reduce the polygons with QEMLoss (in Modeler). Then, merge any points, and press the TAB key to turn on SubPatch mode. Be sure to set SP to about 2 or 3.
projectcoil
12-11-2003, 05:50 AM
freebie (http://projectcoil.dyndns.org/cheetah.lwo)
toddler
12-11-2003, 07:46 AM
Originally posted by projectcoil
freebie (http://projectcoil.dyndns.org/cheetah.lwo)


Hehe, thanks! I'm all about freebies. Esp when they are nice ones, which this looks to be!

thanks!

Insider: I've tried some of that. I'm still trying to get my ilil head around the UV export bits (grabbed uvmapper) from Poser. I had modeler error out on reducing a bunch of poly's on one quick pose I did in Poser. Question: would you 'Pose' in Poser than export, or 'Pose' in 'spread eagle' and export->skelegon->bone->tweak?
toddler
12-11-2003, 07:47 AM
Originally posted by toddler
Hehe, thanks! I'm all about freebies. Esp when they are nice ones, which this looks to be!

thanks!

Insider: I've tried some of that. I'm still trying to get my ilil head around the UV export bits (grabbed uvmapper) from Poser. I had modeler error out on reducing a bunch of poly's on one quick pose I did in Poser. Question: would you 'Pose' in Poser than export, or 'Pose' in 'spread eagle' and export->skelegon->bone->tweak?

Ack, quoting my own post....sigh.

I just looked at your actual sig. Another person who makes me sigh in admiration on awful lot...

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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