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AndrewE
12-09-2003, 12:30 AM
Can I preorder the book if I'm Canadian?

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 11:00 AM
just putting it up....

LittleFenris
12-09-2003, 01:40 PM
I would think if you have a credit card it wouldn't matter if you are canadian or not. why not just go to wordwares site and try to buy it. :shrug:

kurv
12-09-2003, 01:43 PM
AndrewE, sure you can, you would just have to pay shipping charges. We are trying to work out a very inexpensive shipping method.

If you have any questions, feel free to email me directly at wbeckwith@wordware.com I will answer as soon as I possibly can.

What other publisher would do that :)

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 07:33 PM
Exactly!

Not to mention that you are a fan of Stargate SG-1, and talk on these forums. Very smart advertising!

chrisWhite
12-09-2003, 07:37 PM
Wes rocks! :buttrock:

Now, where do we go to buy stock in Wordware? :thumbsup:

kurv
12-09-2003, 07:50 PM
AndrewE - Honestly, I love LW and this community. Ever since I sat down and watch Deuce Bennett make a commercial in Toaster, I was hooked. The next month I met Timothy Albee in San Jose and the we did our first LW book.

If I did what Wordware was paying me to do, you would never see me...I do not get paid to advertise, etc... I am here because I love CG and want to learn as much, as fast as I can!!

I do not post here to advertise, I'm not stupid though, it is a good place to promote new books like this one. But you can ask any of my authors for LightWave, I do not do this literally 14 hours a day because Wordware pays me to (trust me they don’t :) )... I do it because I love LW, NewTek and trying to help others with this stuff (as much as I can).

Don't tell anyone here this (WW) but I would love to be doing CG full time. I now eat, sleep, (insert appropriate items) LightWave. When I look at things, driving, at home, on TV all I think about is “hmmm, how would I model that”, or “I know how they did that” :)

So hopefully you will someday see a studio or a movie and in the credits you might just see my name...someday!!

I can dream...for now until I can make it a reality...

kurv
12-09-2003, 07:52 PM
N2Christ, thanks!! Hey post some of your recent work... I have not seen you in a while until the last few weeks... Where have you been, do you have any wips..?

Good to see you, and thanks again!! YOU ROCK!!!

Steve Warner
12-09-2003, 07:54 PM
Originally posted by wordwarepub
When I look at things, driving, at home, on TV all I think about is “hmmm, how would I model that.
Oh yeah, man. You're hooked! Welcome to the club! :beer:

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 07:59 PM
It's true man.

Like seriously, I didn't know if I wanted to go into the 3D Art field.

AT ALL!

But after I gave it a chance it drug me in and beated me down with it's club. And I love it now. I can't think anything BUT 3D and how to model it.

Right now I'm really really REALLY stuck, I feel like sh*t because I don't know where to go with my work. I don't know how experts do it, I don't know how to model a good face. And everything I try to do is a let down.

I just don't know. This is why I don't post ANY of my work. I just feel down recently. I feel like I should be somewhere else with my work and not where I am currently. I'm not saying to give me pitty, but I'm just lost. And I don't know where to go. That's why I think if I sign up for the Larry Shultz (SplineGod) online training I can maybe move past this stage.

I never know what to model anymore.

chrisWhite
12-09-2003, 08:03 PM
Thanks Wes, I was interning all summer and schools nuts so I haven't had much time until recently. I'll try to post some stuff soon, unfortionatally I haven't been doing much LW stuff, 90% of my free time is going into redesigning my (currently horrible) web-site.

PS: I did respond to your PM a couple of weeks ago, but I got a message saying your box was to full.

LittleFenris
12-09-2003, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by AndrewE
I just don't know. This is why I don't post ANY of my work. I just feel down recently. I feel like I should be somewhere else with my work and not where I am currently. I'm not saying to give me pitty, but I'm just lost. And I don't know where to go. That's why I think if I sign up for the Larry Shultz (SplineGod) online training I can maybe move past this stage.

I have found video courses like Larrys, Dan Ablan's, and Todd Grimes to be a much faster approach to learning the 3D ropes then trying to read a bunch of books (I have a ton of Lightwave books also).

I never know what to model anymore.

Sounds like you need some inspiration somehow. I found inspiration from my new kitten and his crazy personality, thats why he is now staring in a short film I am working on!! You just need to find that inspiration.

Steve Warner
12-09-2003, 08:10 PM
AndrewE, I can't speak for everyone here, but I think what you're going through is fairly common. Check out this thread by a very well respected LightWave user. (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66827).

We all hit plateaus as we grow. The best you can do is not give up. If you keep at it, you will eventually get it. I remember hitting a lull in my development. I took some time off, came back a few months later and had a whole new perspective on things.

Some concepts, like when to Spin Quads and how to develop a good flow are hard to understand. They take time. If you're getting stuck, take some time to go back and hone your skills with inorganic models. In addition to being fun, they don't require you to adhere to the rules that subpatch modeling does. And your successes here will likely help bolster your confidence and give you the motivation to tackle organic modeling again.

Hang in there. You're not alone. :)

Cheers!

Steve

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 08:10 PM
Yeah, seriously.

I have no clue, at all.

I just feel like I'm talking to giants on this forum, everyone does AMAZING work, if I post any of my work I know it won't get flamed but subconcious I just feel that it will be flamed.

I just don't know. I wish I could get some in person training from some of the greats.

kurv
12-09-2003, 08:10 PM
AndrewE, heres is my 2 cents on your comments...

I felt the EXACT same way after seeing Deuce in person do things. He was going SOO fast, and made things that I know take other people hours...in minutes. Then when I would try to play with LW I got no where but discouraged.

Let me tell you, I had to just decide to dive into it and not come up for air until I knew how to do things...damn it!!

You have to not let your "feeling inadequate" get you down. We all go through slumps, the pro's do too!! The difference is they push away from the computer for a little bit, go gather themselves and get "re-inspired"!!

You have you be able to do the same things, and I bet some of your problem, like me, is planning. I HATE to do the boring stuff…I just want to model, not draw, look at the muscle flow of the face, check the poly flow…etc.. I just want to model…!!!!

But you HAVE to do the boring stuff to get to do the kick a$$ stuff…that’s life.

Hope this helps, seriously!! Post some work man, get re-inspired!! Who cares what other people think about your work as long as YOU’RE learning. Don’t worry about others opinions unless YOU think they are right.

Tim responded one time to an email I sent him of my columns wip… He said I can not critique your work, you know what if anything is wrong with it, judge yourself. You know, he is right!!

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 08:16 PM
Yeah, I judge myself soo hard.

Seriously. I do.

I just don't want to post anything until I think I have something I want to post.

It feels I bring nothing to this community.

Yet I strive to be the best in the world someday.

But I just feel like I'm hitting a wall with my head recently... :banghead:

So I don't know, I really don't.

I love to look at bodies in motion, and I love to watch people talk. I just love watching the enviroment, the people everything in my life. I know that's not the problem. I'm currently in a 3D only course. I think after this I'm going to go into a 3 year traditional art training.

But meh, I don't know.

I have a firm grasp on traditional methods, but not the nitty gritty stuff right now.

kurv
12-09-2003, 08:20 PM
Hey, I went to get a drink and thought of something else...

Don’t put to much pressure on yourself when doing this stuff. I watch people like Larry Shultz, Steve Warner, Christophe Desse, PiSong (and many others)...and get used to seeing greatness (that’s a term now, I'm a publisher)...

Don’t aspire to that if your not at that level and don’t judge yourself to that level either… Heck I WISH I could model like that… But someday with some training you will be able to.

Don’t hold back AndrewE… You’ll never improve unless you do it, and you’ll never stretch yourself unless you show others your work :)

kurv
12-09-2003, 08:21 PM
You just posted exactly what I was thinking...

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 08:22 PM
I know, but I feel as if I should totally rock. But I'm lacking some of the technique I need to dip into some of the deep stuff.

I think that's my biggest problem.

kurv
12-09-2003, 08:32 PM
Well only you can tell that...

You have to be the first person to put yourself back on the horse...

chrisWhite
12-09-2003, 08:36 PM
Andrew, I know exactly how you feel, I was there a month or two ago, you can't judge yourself to hard. Your probably never going to have a project that you think is perfect, last time I checked we are all still human here and I don't think any of us have achieved perfection. Also, when you judge yourself by masters the only thing it tends to do is depress, at least that's how I feel, but I think the key is not leveling off in quality. As long as your learning and improving with each new project (on avarage) then I think you can be happy with your self. You may someday be the best in the world at CG, but right now your probably not, what matters though is your moving up the notches and are commited to excelence. But it's got to be excelence for you, sometimes I have to say I'm done with the project and may be bummed at the results, but when I go back and compare it with my older work it cheers me up and inspires me.

That may not have made any sense at all, but I know it's how I have to think when I feel this way.

kurv
12-09-2003, 08:43 PM
Well put!! N2Christ!!

LittleFenris
12-09-2003, 09:15 PM
I've always been curious what N2Christ means? Or does it mean nothing? (other than Christian propeganda on the CG forums :p)

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 09:23 PM
Yeah, thanks NSChrist.

It does help a lot when I do look at my previous work.

But you know, it's just that looking at some of this work is just soo amazing. It's just tough to grasp.

Steve Warner
12-09-2003, 09:35 PM
http://www.trinitymediainc.com/Help/firsthead.jpg


Ok, Andrew. Just to show you that I have no pride whatsoever, here's a screengrab of my first head model.

Yes, I know. It blows dead apes. :surprised To make matters worse, it took me several days just to do this. But here's the deal. No matter how proficient I might currently be at modeling, I didn't start out that way. None of us did. And anyone who claims otherwise is a liar.

I can honestly tell you that when I see new users post their work, I don't think, "Oh, God, that's horrible!" On the contrary, I'm brought back to a time when I was struggling with the same things. And that humbles me. And it motivates me to help. Because I didn't figure it all out on my own. I leaned on the people that I look up to.

Hang in there, Andrew. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, and it's not as far off as it might seem.

All my best,

Steve

AndrewE
12-09-2003, 09:49 PM
Thanks Steve, that REALLY means a lot.

Seriously, thank you.

(but that's still better than I can do!)

chrisWhite
12-09-2003, 09:52 PM
VWTornado,

Because you asked, I will say that the reason I use that name, my avatar, and title, is because I am a Christian. Christ is first and foremost in my life, and, CG, and everything else in my life, is second to my relationship with Him. My real name (Christopher) means Christ-bearer, and I want to reflect that in everything I do.

I’m not trying to be preachy or post Christian propaganda on here. I know that this isn’t the place for that and I want to respect everyone here by keeping on the topic of CG. If you (or anyone) would like it discuss it further feel free to PM me as I don't want to hijack the thread or offend anyone.

Andrew,

It does feel like it's tough to grasp, I'm constantly in awe of others work, especially character work because I don't think I could even do Steve's first work without four or five tries. But if you keep at it, I'm sure you'll make it. Think we have all these books and all this help on here, I'd say we have it made, lol.

Edit\ I keep forgetting to add to a post that you guys are more then welcome to call me Chris if you want, it's a bit quicker and easier to type :)

kurv
12-09-2003, 09:58 PM
AndrewE, N2Christ brings a good point to the table. Use your resources...Post a model here, and let the group help you with it, give you tips and tricks on how to improve.

I think it would be a thread similar to the head modeling thread and would help a lot of people...

IMHO...!

AndrewE
12-10-2003, 12:52 AM
Man, why do you guys have to be like better than my friends in real life.

You guys rule.

Thanks.

I will post some of my progress further down the road AFTER I feel like I should post it.

Most of my work is crap.

SplineGod
12-10-2003, 01:36 AM
Andrew you do have time and some big advantages over me when I was learning:
Lightwave and 3D in general was MUCH more primitive then it is now. When I started all you could see were wireframes and no shading and no opengl. Now you have so many tools to shorten the learning process.

Theres lots of training materials and books out now. When I was starting out there was nothing really and you just sort of had to figure it out on your own. Now you have not just the books and stuff but forums like this.

The software was horribly expensive and so were machines and both were VERY slow. When Truespace first came out on the Amiga as Caligari it was $3000.00. The software that Maya and XSI evolved from could run well over $100,000.00 I remember waiting up to 48 HOURS to see a chrome ball over a checkerboard groundplane only to see a black screen at the end of the render because I forgot to turn a light on.

Youll figure this stuff out. I go back and look at my old stuff and cringe too. :)

On another note:
Steve that head is hilarious! Youve definately come a long way yourself! :)

AndrewE
12-10-2003, 11:33 AM
Yup Yup.

tonyg
12-10-2003, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by AndrewE
I will post some of my progress further down the road AFTER I feel like I should post it. Most of my work is crap.

Andrew;

That's the way it is though; we all feel like what we are doing is not as good as it should be (or, I speak for myself, but it sounds like a lot of people feel this way too). What's great (and scary) about this busines sis that no matter how much you learn, you will alwyas feel like you are just starting out. No matter how good you get, there will always be someone who comes along and blows yoru mind. When you are new, a lot fo those someone's are more expereicnced than you, and you think "How can I catch up?" Amazingly, as you get older, half the time, that someone will be years younger and less experienced thatn you!

Art is not a competition, it is a creation, and all of the art you do is worthwhile. If some of it does not inspire you to share it, then that's Ok -- but I think it realy helps to show your work -- art created but never seen is a pity, whether you like it or not -- you can learn so much from the feedback of others (a swe all do in these forums), and it is also the case that your WIP head may inspire another, less experienced artist, even if you are not happy with it...

As a word of more finite encouragement, it is as SplineGod says; you are entering an industry that offers a lot of resources and choices (more than ever before), and you have your whole career as an artist ahead of you to take advantage of that! It takes years to learn the craft, but you have a great start, and will just continue to improve as an artist, and as a technical user (and get to use some great tools along the way, and learn from other artists and... it is really the best possible place to be at 19...).

Tony

tonyg
12-10-2003, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by AndrewE
Can I preorder the book if I'm Canadian?

Did I miss a link to this books' title and author?

Steve Warner
12-10-2003, 02:27 PM
Hi Tony,

Here's the link to Wordware's site:

http://www.wordware.com/tnt/

And here's the thread on CGTalk:

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=105731

Cheers!

Steve

tonyg
12-10-2003, 02:29 PM
Steve;

Thanks!

Tony

Originally posted by Steve Warner
Hi Tony,

Here's the link to Wordware's site:

http://www.wordware.com/tnt/

And here's the thread on CGTalk:

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=105731

Cheers!

Steve

alanchan
12-10-2003, 02:50 PM
Andrew - best advice I can give you is to do something that has a deep personal meaning to you. Make that your backburner project - something you do as you go. That way, as your work on other things starts to wear you down, you'll always have a 'safe harbor' to return to.

I write. I do short films. They take longer to do since I hold down a full time job in visual effects. But when the vfx work gets rote and boring (as they often do - this industry isn't quite all glamour), I always have my own projects to fall back on.

Do you want to change the world? Ask yourself how you can, and make plans for it.

kurv
12-10-2003, 02:59 PM
Thanks Steve, you beat me to it :)

Great advice alanchan!!

AndrewE, I think after all of this support you owe it to the gang here to post some work... (no pressure :) )...

Post some dude!!! We won’t sling rocks at you...

AndrewE
12-10-2003, 03:16 PM
Thanks a lot guys, seriously.

Like my god. You guys have really helped me with a lot of confidence.

Oh, for those of you don't know, Tony is my 3D teacher.

:thumbsup:

AndrewE
12-10-2003, 03:45 PM
http://andrewe.50megs.com/AndrewE_Bike.jpg

There you go....

Steve Warner
12-10-2003, 04:00 PM
Dude! What do you mean you suck??? This looks pretty darn great to me! :applause:

kurv
12-10-2003, 04:03 PM
See that’s really nice work. I like it a lot…nice texture on the tires!!!

Maybe I am wrong here, you tell me... But are you trying to jump from this right to a head model..?

If you are, man do the middle work first...

While I think I am coming along pretty well if you look at my models, I have a columns WIP (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=103576) that took me more than 4 hours, 6 if you count the correction work after posting. I have a rocket ship (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=104259) from Larrys videos and a transport ship (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=105477), also from Larrys videos. These are basic compaired to a head model...

Don't try to jump the building first thing Neo, you will just hit the ground and get frustrated.

Train, learn, keep up this great work... Model more things that are easier first, trust me you will learn new things every time you do it...I did!!

LittleFenris
12-10-2003, 04:42 PM
Holy %$#%$!! You were worried about posting that?!?! That cycle looks awesome. :buttrock: Post more!!

chrisWhite
12-10-2003, 04:45 PM
Dude, you've got to be kidding me, that's awesome! I'm much more an environment guy at this stage and that just blows me away, I would have no clue how to do that.

Wes does have a good point if your going straight from mechanical stuff to faces, I'd try to do some easier organic modeling first just to get used to the workflow for that type of modeling.

:buttrock: :buttrock:

AndrewE
12-10-2003, 05:59 PM
Thanks a lot guys...

That's the one thing that I actually think is worthy of posting on here.

But yeah.

There you go.

I might have the confidence to post more of my stuff on here later.

kurv
12-10-2003, 08:55 PM
The chants start from the outfield....

MORE... MORE... MORE.. MORE...MORE...MORE...!!!

Steve Warner
12-10-2003, 08:57 PM
Yeah! MORE MORE MORE MORE MORE!!!

chrisWhite
12-10-2003, 09:01 PM
There seams to be a echo in here, wait, it's everyone screaming MORE MORE MORE!

AndrewE
12-10-2003, 10:56 PM
hahaha

Stop it. I have nothing more to bring to the table.

Maybe next year...

chrisWhite
12-10-2003, 11:12 PM
Okay then, Jan 1st were expecting to see another cool image.

AndrewE
12-11-2003, 01:49 AM
Deal!

Or not...

:cool:

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