PDA

View Full Version : Transfer of Hard Drive


Novakog
12-04-2003, 03:51 AM
I was thinkin bout getting a new computer, and this is what I was wondering about.

1) Are pretty much all Hard Drives (as long as they're both IDE or both SCSI) compatible?

2) If I were to put one small HD in on the computer from the start, and install the OS and all the drivers, could I then take my HD from my current computer and put it in my new computer and have all the programs work (of course, the OS would have to be the same), or only have to "reconfigure" programs? In other words, could I do this and still use all my applications w/o reinstalling them?

3) If #2 does work, is there a way I can specifically uninstall the OS part of my current HD (just to free up one or two GBs or something), cuz I'll only need the one in the new HD.

Thanks in advance.

singularity2006
12-04-2003, 05:21 AM
Your windows OS would go all haywire if u tried to move the whole HD to another system. However, that is only the case if the system you are using is in terms of hardware, radically different from your original. I wouldn't try it (again). Windows 2K and XP in particular don't like being moved like that.

And just for examples of what else could happen:

1. The system may not ever boot, u'd get blue screen errors from not until forever.
2. It might boot, but you'll be re-installing all sorts of drivers like mad
3. It might boot and then you'll have an inredibly unstable system.

The issue is mostly that when you first install Windows, it's installing a huge set of drivers for all the hardware on your system. However, moving the drive to a new system with different hardware will be like trying to ...... mix dog and cat DNA. It won't work (well, that's probably a bad example... but u get the ideA).

And even if you reinstalled drivers like mad, the system would be very unstable still. However, if all the hardware were IDENTICAL on both systems, you should be able to transfer the HD over no problem.

Novakog
12-04-2003, 08:21 AM
No no, you misunderstood. I would have a NEW HD on my new system which would have an entirely newly installed OS, and I would designate THAT drive as the HD to run the OS from, AFTER which I would put the old HD in. I wouldn't dare attempt to use the old OS on a new system.

When I said "The OS would have to be the same" I meant that they'd both have to be WinXP, Win2K, or whatever, I didn't mean I would actually take the OS from the old HD.

The hardware is NOT identical btw.

jbw
12-04-2003, 10:56 AM
Hey Novakog,

If I were to put one small HD in on the computer from the start, and install the OS and all the drivers, could I then take my HD from my current computer and put it in my new computer and have all the programs work (of course, the OS would have to be the same), or only have to "reconfigure" programs? In other words, could I do this and still use all my applications w/o reinstalling them?

I tend to transfer HDs from old to new machines (at work and at home) but never drives with software/programs on, only ever work drives. If I've read the question correctly (which I think I have) then the answer is yes and no (AFAIK). It depends on the software and I believe that some programs write registry entries so they can run whilst others don't. Personally I think it'd be quicker to re-install everything on the other machine than faff around trying to reconfigure software to run on another machine? :shrug:

ta,
jbw

theboykidney
12-04-2003, 03:33 PM
I got a question kinda on the same lines....i have a couple partitions on my drive, 1 for the OS [xp pro, drive C:] and another for all the apps[P:\]. if i formatted C: and reinstalled XP the apps wouldnt work cause the registry is gone...but if i backed up the registry before formatting and then re-installed it after, would the apps work?

jbw
12-04-2003, 03:44 PM
Probably... but I'm loathe to do anything like that cos my box at home is used for freelance and occassionally I work from home so I need something stable. My theory is...
Whilst it might work fine and save you the 3 hours it'd take to install all your apps you might find that errors brought about by re-using the registry might cause loss of work or the inability to work totalling way more than 3 hours. :shrug:

I'll confess I'm not a technical whizz though.

ta,
jbw

singularity2006
12-04-2003, 06:10 PM
Originally posted by Novakog
No no, you misunderstood. I would have a NEW HD on my new system which would have an entirely newly installed OS, and I would designate THAT drive as the HD to run the OS from, AFTER which I would put the old HD in. I wouldn't dare attempt to use the old OS on a new system.

When I said "The OS would have to be the same" I meant that they'd both have to be WinXP, Win2K, or whatever, I didn't mean I would actually take the OS from the old HD.

The hardware is NOT identical btw.

O. In that case, u should be good to go. :thumbsup: And as for the BoyKidney, what u suggest might work. But it's not a sure fire way of doing things. On a Mac, u could probably do funny things like that because they don't use a centralized registry like Windows so it's easy to add or remove components. Ohterwise, I wouldn't do it on a Windows based system.

Novakog
12-05-2003, 01:10 AM
Ya, I would just reinstall the software, except:

1) I have an ENORMOUS amount of software on my computer, probably at least 30 commonly used apps I'd want to have on the new computer

2) I've lost the CDs for quite a few of them (my current computer is 3-4 yrs old, and I can't keep track of CDs for that long), so I'd have to buy new ones....

Well, I'll try. Worst case is, I'll just have to reinstall the apps on my new system like you guys (except singularity) suggested initially, so it wouldn't matter. I'll let you guys know how it works out when I do it (won't be for a couple months though), thanks for the replies!

mastermesh
12-05-2003, 07:35 PM
Whilst it might work fine and save you the 3 hours it'd take to install all your apps you might find that errors brought about by re-using the registry might cause loss of work or the inability to work totalling way more than 3 hours
I wish it only took 3 hours to install everything... I have litereally a TON of software that I keep on my system... several cd cases full!!! It usually takes me at least a week of nights and a weekend with 2 full days work to get my stuff all reinstalled and clean in the order that it has to be put in so that I like it - some things can only be installed before some other things and after other stuff in a certain order for it all to work... It's a massive PAIN to redo everything... especially if you have more than one os installed...

Right now, I have about 3 and a half computers going in my little networked world... 1 has Windows 98 dual booted with Suse Linux and Windows XP, another has Suse/Windows XP and about 40 gigs of programs installed (yes I use some obscure stuff so I do usually use em all eventually) and one computer that's basically just a souped up version of a zip drive that has windows xp on it solely so that the drive is accessible at all times to the other computers - that computer has 1 160 gig drive + 1 30 gig drive... the half computer is an external hard drive that I use for storing permanent project stuff... external drives usually don't go bad and die when os dies since it's on a usb and is safe from Windows midas touch of death.

Novakog
12-06-2003, 12:07 AM
I'm with you on that, it would take at least 10 solid hours to install everything on my new comp that I'd want to use, and probably another $400 at least for buying software I lost (which would be getting deleted from this computer even if I didn't transfer the HD).

singularity2006
12-06-2003, 08:51 AM
consolidate, consolidate, conslidate!! I know what you mean about that. I used to have a ton of stuff too. But then I started learning the in-dept functions of most of my software and began weeding out the software I didn't need anymore because I found the same function in an app I knew better. It used to take me a full 24 hours to get a system down solid but now I've cut it down to 12.


And that's of course, 12 hours including the time it takes to customize everything, colors, desktop, applications, and icons and the like. It also includes time to use XPLite to kill off as much of the Windows install as possible, then Diskeeper Pro defrag the sux0r, and so forth... so it's down solid. :)

Mr_Smee
12-07-2003, 07:09 PM
You could clone your hard drive to the new one. Then you wouldn't have to reinstall anything. Only problem depending on your operating system is the Motherboard drivers etc. that may need to be installed.

I have done this before with XP. I would rather install from scratch though. You could try cloning the drive and seeing if it works if it doesn't you still have the old drive working and you can format over the new one.

I've used Norton Ghost quite a few times with success.

Novakog
12-07-2003, 10:43 PM
Ya, well, wouldn't cloning have the same effect as if I just transferred the HD, not to mention being cheaper (1 because of the price of Ghost and 2 because of buying a new HD)?. I will consider cloning though, cause my HD is running out of space and I need a bigger one. I have a couple questions though:

1) Is cloning basically the same thing as copying all the files to another HD?
2) How long would it take to clone say, 60 Gb of files (yes, I know that's a lot... no, I don't use all those, I use about half of it :p, but I'm too lazy right now to sort through my stuff and find what I don't need, I'll probably do it the same time I build the computer, usually only takes me a few hours though).

Singularity: Well, I mean I have a lot of programs that are completely different programs, I rarely, if ever, use programs that overlap in their function or "genre" (like I don't have 2 3d CG programs, or 2 2d cg programs, 2 script writing/syntax highlighting programs, 2 media player programs, etc.), so that consolidating wouldn't help me much.

Mr_Smee
12-08-2003, 02:41 AM
Well cloning the drive does just that. It makes an exact image of your drive and copies it over to the new drive. If you just COPY the files programs etc. to the new drive 90% or more of your programs won't work. They would have to be reinstalled. Figure the time it would take to reinstall all your programs or an hour at the most to clone the drive.

I just cloned a 20 gig drive a couple days ago and took about a half hour. So about 1.5 hours for a 60 gig.

I think Ghost comes packaged with System Works. Probably the pro version. Don't remember the price though. Might be cheaper then buying just Ghost by itself.

One of the cool things you can do with it is make a cdrom image of your drive also. Of course 60 gigs would be a lot of cd's :)

grubGrob
12-09-2003, 12:54 AM
Some of your apps from your (NOW SECONDARY HDD) old hard drive may work .

From windows explorer. browse to the old HDD that is obviosly not the one with new OS and click on the applications exe file. Some of them will work and some wont. The ones that will work might ask you to re regeister. Delete the whole folder of the ones ones that wont, no need to UNISTALL cause there not on the new hdd, (ie: no registry entry)

If it works , you can copy the whole folder accross to the NEW "C: ~program files" folder

there is no short cut as to what works and what wont, you just have to try it out.

Once all tested ... re-format your old HDD and then you have an excellent scratch or back up or GHOSTED hdd in case of the dreaded failure thingy that has happened or is going to happen to ALL of us.

Personally I installed all my software ... tweaked my system, turned off all microsoft redundant stuff and ghosted my FRESH DEFRAGGED SCANNED fully installed and ready to rock system ... then I ghosted it. then unplugged the power and IDE. there it sits waiting for my next major catastropie to occur... I save all my progressive work as I go somplace else... disk or HDD f: or something.

Novakog
12-09-2003, 01:52 AM
I see, so cloning reconfigures all your software to the new system?

Genius...

I'll definitely check that out, do that if you tranferring the HD doesn't work (after all, what's the harm in doing so?).

Novakog
12-09-2003, 03:25 AM
I was looking, and cloning seems to be a really good idea. My question is, I found that I can get Norton Systemworks Pro (which has Norton Ghost) OEM for $23 (including shipping and tax and all) from here: http://www.antivirusovernight.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=0007&Category_Code=ALLPROD&Product_Count=25

Whereas Ghost retail on its own is $69. Would it matter much if I got this OEM, I mean, the only things I need are the CD and CD key?

Mr_Smee
12-09-2003, 03:31 AM
To do what you want to do that would work fine. They have a newer version I believe but for that price it will do what you want. There shouldn't be any cd key for that anyway. The latest version requires you to register.

Sounds like a good deal to me. Plus you get the antivirus which you can update for a year.

Originally posted by Novakog
I was looking, and cloning seems to be a really good idea. My question is, I found that I can get Norton Systemworks Pro (which has Norton Ghost) OEM for $23 (including shipping and tax and all) from here: http://www.antivirusovernight.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=0007&Category_Code=ALLPROD&Product_Count=25

Whereas Ghost retail on its own is $69. Would it matter much if I got this OEM, I mean, the only things I need are the CD and CD key?

Mr_Smee
12-09-2003, 06:38 AM
Cloning just makes a carbon copy of your drive to the new drive. Doesn't configure anything. Copies all the hidden files, partitions etc.

Has been a life saver for my business.

As long as you don't destroy your old hard drive wouldn't hurt to try whatever you want. You can always format the new drive again.


Originally posted by Novakog
I see, so cloning reconfigures all your software to the new system?

Genius...

I'll definitely check that out, do that if you tranferring the HD doesn't work (after all, what's the harm in doing so?).

Novakog
12-09-2003, 06:55 AM
Ok, being that I'm new to this and all, what exactly is a partition?

Will it allow me to transfer my programs and everything "needed" to run them without transferring the drivers/old OS over?

Mr_Smee
12-09-2003, 07:39 AM
It copies EVERYTHING. When you are done you can boot up from the new hard drive. XP will install the new drivers when it boots up the first time. If it causes problems you can just format over the new drive and spend all day installing from scratch.

It all boils down to how much time you have to do it.

Originally posted by Novakog
So wait, I'm assuming that cloning doesn't copy the OS, correct? I mean, if it did, like they said, wouldn't it be really buggy and all, and the OS would have to be configured to all the new hardware for it all the work properly...

FUG1T1VE
12-10-2003, 12:24 AM
what exactly is a partition? I can think of an easy way of explaining a partition. Its basically a pie and depending on how big the pie is (HDD) you can divide it in many ways, the most common parition is Windows/Linux one half for you one half for me. but you cant take an inch from my piece and vice versa. in turn its like having two separete drives in one drive. Does it make sense.

I'm going through a similar stage.
At home I have Windows ME ( crappiest OS ever) but it came with the pc, now I finally bought XPpro. at school I use a mac with 2d programs, ie photoshop, flash, and others that as long as I have the extensions on the files I dont need a MAC well maybe in the future. What I'm doing is I got an external HDD, and made it compatible with both OSX and XP pro, but since I dont have XP on my machine the external drive does not show up on ME Trying to figure out why? since you have over 40cd's x 600mb(around) =24000MB about 24 gigs external drives range from 40-200gigs. I think an external drive is good to have handy, but depending on the one you get they can be slow, tranfers 20gigs in 5 hours or so. The safest best would be to save your files on an external drive.
My question is, Im going to need another drive for my pc. If I install (format) it on Windows ME will the HDD work when I install XP on the same computer? or will it ask me to reformat it thus loosing all the files saved on it.

Mr_Smee
12-10-2003, 01:25 AM
Your external drive could be formatted with another file system. Such as NTFS which ME can't read.

If your formatting a drive on the ME computer it will format it as FAT32. XP will read FAT32 but you would probably want NTFS on the main drive if XP will be your operation system. I believe you have the option to keep it as FAT32 or Change it to NTFS when you install XP.

Originally posted by NAKO
what exactly is a partition? I can think of an easy way of explaining a partition. Its basically a pie and depending on how big the pie is (HDD) you can divide it in many ways, the most common parition is Windows/Linux one half for you one half for me. but you cant take an inch from my piece and vice versa. in turn its like having two separete drives in one drive. Does it make sense.

I'm going through a similar stage.
At home I have Windows ME ( crappiest OS ever) but it came with the pc, now I finally bought XPpro. at school I use a mac with 2d programs, ie photoshop, flash, and others that as long as I have the extensions on the files I dont need a MAC well maybe in the future. What I'm doing is I got an external HDD, and made it compatible with both OSX and XP pro, but since I dont have XP on my machine the external drive does not show up on ME Trying to figure out why? since you have over 40cd's x 600mb(around) =24000MB about 24 gigs external drives range from 40-200gigs. I think an external drive is good to have handy, but depending on the one you get they can be slow, tranfers 20gigs in 5 hours or so. The safest best would be to save your files on an external drive.
My question is, Im going to need another drive for my pc. If I install (format) it on Windows ME will the HDD work when I install XP on the same computer? or will it ask me to reformat it thus loosing all the files saved on it.

grubGrob
12-10-2003, 01:52 AM
Me is a FAT 32 type OS while XP is is either FAT 23 or NTFS.

they are didferent indeed.

Me cant see xp files under NTFS but can under FAT 32
Xp(NTFS) can seeMe files under Fat 32.

break in the rule: XP offers you to install under FAT 32. if you do this you wont have the NTFS opperating sys.

Simple solution: Partition your ETRA LARGE HDD and install XP as a second opperating sys on a seperate partition.
When installed you can set a BOOT to ask you which oppreating system you wanna use.

Advice : Install XP under NTFS because its goooooood! VERY STABLE.

The only reason to keep your ME OS is cause some of you Hardware is outdated and you cant find drivers that work under XP... AND THAT IS THE ONLY REASON... so do check to see if your flash drive and your cammera and your scanner and the rest of you circa 1956 hardware has drivers for XP ;o )

Good luck.

might help to try this on a new HDD just in case or at least on a fresh partition.

Novakog
12-10-2003, 01:55 AM
Ohhh, so a partition is like a seperation of disk space to two seperate OS's, and then you can obviously tell the computer to boot from different partitions (using different OSs). Awesome.

grubGrob
12-10-2003, 12:03 PM
ok so you got the idea of Partition and dual boot...

to set the choice you need to run XP and go to My computer (right click) and click ADVANCED and then START UP... enable the fast detect and which opperating system as defult etc..

good luck

Novakog
12-10-2003, 10:49 PM
Thanks (although I'm not actually going to use partitions... yet...)!

I love this forum :thumbsup:.

Ice Czar
12-11-2003, 04:42 AM
Originally posted by Novakog
I was thinkin bout getting a new computer, and this is what I was wondering about.

1) Are pretty much all Hard Drives (as long as they're both IDE or both SCSI) compatible?

2) If I were to put one small HD in on the computer from the start, and install the OS and all the drivers, could I then take my HD from my current computer and put it in my new computer and have all the programs work (of course, the OS would have to be the same), or only have to "reconfigure" programs? In other words, could I do this and still use all my applications w/o reinstalling them?

3) If #2 does work, is there a way I can specifically uninstall the OS part of my current HD (just to free up one or two GBs or something), cuz I'll only need the one in the new HD.

Thanks in advance.

1. yes and no, there are many SCSI standards, they are however typically backward compatible, but mixing SCSI2 w\ U320 doesnt make alot of sense. There are also some issues mixing antique ATA/ATAPI (IDE) devices, but provided your using modern drives (HDD CDR DVDR) you should be fine. The issues arise when Independent Master/Slave Device Timing (http://www.pcguide.com/ref/hdd/if/ide/confTiming-c.html) tries to deal with one device employing PIO and another using UDMA.

2. Generally as mentioned you need to reinstall the major aps, as they need to be in the "new" registry hive. some applications can simply run from whatever directory they happen to be on, but that typically isnt true for the major applications (like Photoshop)
They can be migrated, but it aint easy.

3. Just delete it, since its not part of the current OS


Moving Disks (http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/reskit/prkb_cnc_ykyz.asp)
navigate up the tree to review all of Chapter 12 ;)

Like grubGrob I image (using Ghost (http://ghost.radified.com/ghost_1.htm))my OS after I install all my aps, configure security and tweak it (and test it for satbility) The other leading Imaging program is PowerQuests Drive Image (PQ was just aquired by Symantec)
and there are several less feature rich freeware aps as well
if you have a network to image with g4u if not HDClone, both happen to be on the Ultimate Boot CD (http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/) Freeware CD ISO, along with alot of very useful but (mainly) advanced tools

a Partition Primer
Primary and Extended Partitions and Logical Drives (http://www.storagereview.com/guide2000/ref/hdd/file/structPartitions.html)
Definition of System and Boot Partition (http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=100525)
Understanding Multibooting (http://www.goodells.net/multiboot/)
How W2K \ XP \ W2K3 Assigns, Reserves, and Stores Drive Letters (http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=KB;EN-US;q234048&)
Partitioning Strategies (http://partition.radified.com/partitioning.htm)

Under Windows you are allowed 4 Primary Partitions OR 3 Primary and one Extended Partion which can contain additional Logical Drives, however you must maintain the primary partition it is an extension of to avoid problems.

And stay away from Dynamic Disks (http://www.labmice.net/Windows2000/diskmgmt/dynamic_disk.htm) unless you are fully aware of the consequences ;)

Novakog
12-11-2003, 05:06 AM
I think I've decided to just get a new HD and clone everything (including apps), and obviously install the new drivers. Theoretically, that should work, shouldn't it? I mean, the only data at all that's different is the drivers, and installing new drivers regularly or changing components works fine without reinstalling programs or anything.

Ice Czar
12-11-2003, 02:56 PM
you need to unload the drivers before you clone or more than likely you will not be able to boot

and it can still lead to headaches, fixable, but time might be better spent on the fresh install

also if its XP there is reactivation

Novakog
12-12-2003, 12:26 AM
Originally posted by Ice Czar
you need to unload the drivers before you clone or more than likely you will not be able to boot

and it can still lead to headaches, fixable, but time might be better spent on the fresh install

also if its XP there is reactivation

Ya, I know to unload the drivers. I highly doubt time would be better spent on the fresh install, it would probably take me at least 8 more hours to install all the software I want (and again, I'd have to rebuy some of the CDs I'd lost).

What's reactivation? As, in I have to activate it again after cloning (using a CD key or online registration or whatever?)? That's no problem.

Ice Czar
12-12-2003, 03:42 AM
RE: Reactivation, the OS will note the change in components and youll need to contact Microsoft to reactivate it

If you run into problems sorting them out could well exceed 8 hours, but if you have to re-purchase software.....
Its probably worth the hassle

Good Luck

Mr_Smee
12-12-2003, 08:33 PM
I think XP can just activate online. Like I said earlier if something doesn't work you can always format over the new drive and start over.

Good Luck!

Originally posted by Novakog
Ya, I know to unload the drivers. I highly doubt time would be better spent on the fresh install, it would probably take me at least 8 more hours to install all the software I want (and again, I'd have to rebuy some of the CDs I'd lost).

What's reactivation? As, in I have to activate it again after cloning (using a CD key or online registration or whatever?)? That's no problem.

FUG1T1VE
12-12-2003, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by grubGrob
Me is a FAT 32 type OS while XP is is either FAT 23 or NTFS.

they are didferent indeed.

Me cant see xp files under NTFS but can under FAT 32
Xp(NTFS) can seeMe files under Fat 32.

break in the rule: XP offers you to install under FAT 32. if you do this you wont have the NTFS opperating sys.

Simple solution: Partition your ETRA LARGE HDD and install XP as a second opperating sys on a seperate partition.
When installed you can set a BOOT to ask you which oppreating system you wanna use.

Advice : Install XP under NTFS because its goooooood! VERY STABLE.

Here is what Im going to try this weekend. Im going to reformat the external drive (FAT 32 type ) so that ME and Mac OS can read it, Im going to get my files out, and then Im going to install XP on the same machine. XP should have no trouble reading the external drive right. :) Thanks for all the help guys.

CGTalk Moderation
01-16-2006, 09:00 PM
This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.