Mental Ray - Shaders

[JeffPatton]

What are you using for an environment? If you have limited color variations in the environment, then you'll have limited colors on the diamond models. I'd say the important things on gems would be:
1) Shape & facets of the model itself (looks like you have that covered)
2) Environment - The objects/materials will only look as good as it's environment allows.
3) Material/Lighting/dispersion/caustics, yadda, yadda...

So if you want only black & white, try using one of those black & white chrome maps that comes with max in the environment and see if that helps. A good hdr should give results like this:
http://jeffpatton.net/Temp/gems.jpg
(sorry, I didn't have a ringset to place these in)

There's also some .hdr's that come with max now, so you might want to try those also.

But IMHO, a diamond will only "come to life" when the dispersion effect is added (I wish a good dispersion shader came with Max9).

[saiko]

Hi Jeff!

When are you going to post your exploration with MR 3.5 in Max 9, it’s supposed to be better than the previous version?

Whenever new version shipped you came up with really nice exploration and added in this thread, I am eagerly waiting for the exploration based on MR 3.5, and I’m sure others as well!

Cheers,
Saikat

[Blitzo]

Those are great renders! I am trying to achieve this without the use of hdri's preferably. There's not enough control over reflections with hdri's. I am setting up white card deflectors and a main light from above (typical studio setup). This produces nice reflections in the metal rings.

Is there a way to mimic dispersion from a diamond without caustics? I think I saw one that you made but would this work without an hdri?

I'll post another screenshot once I've come closer.

[Blitzo]

(sorry, I didn't have a ringset to place these in)


Did you want me to send you the max file or model that I'm using? I really appreciate the help so far.

[JeffPatton]

Is there a way to mimic dispersion from a diamond without caustics? I think I saw one that you made but would this work without an hdri?There's a few discussion in this thread about a dispersion shader that's available. A thread search for dispersion should turn it up without too much fuss.

EDIT: The shader is actually called diffraction shader I belive.

Beyond that, there are ways to fake the effect (not as realistic of course), but I have one example on my website, and Pete Draper has a tutorial here:
http://www.3d-palace.com/xenomorphic/education/doc_refraction.htm

[Blitzo]

Here's a sample animation using Jeff's material on the diamonds. I like the way it's progressing however I need to tone down the glare and get some color in the diamonds.

www.visualkinetix.com/mr-anim.html (http://www.visualkinetix.com/mr-anim.html)

[Blitzo]

Is it possible to setup a diffuse area light as shown in the picture below in mental ray? This is the type of soft lighting used to light up jewelry for photography.

http://ny.webphotoschool.com/Shooting_Jewelry_in_a_Tent/1110916218_fig26.jpg

Here's the map I made in photoshop that kind of mimics the diffuse light:

http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/9278/lightbox3nc2.jpg

[JeffPatton]

Eh, that's really a lighting question moreso than a shader question (or did I misunderstand the question?). I'd start a new thread outside the shader thread here about the light settings.

You may want to end up using the diffraction shader. I just added a larger test render to my portfolio gallery here at CGtalk using Daniel's diffraction shader if you want to see an example of that.

[Blitzo]

Sorry about the lighting post. I'll put that up on another thread.

Those diamonds in your portfolio are perfect! I'll do a seacrh for diffraction and try it on the ring.

[Blitzo]

Can you post the settings you used to achieve your results? I'm having trouble getting enough "bounces" in the diamond. All I see is black and white.

[JeffPatton]

Attached a screen grab of the diffraction settings.

[rodrigogua]

hiya guys! a quick lighting and shading excercise i did today. wanted to acheive a clean, studio lighting setup and render. the model isn't mine, i downloaded it from the free stuff thread at evermotion.com. everything else is mine though, and can share it with you guys if you want it. you can kind of see the setup on the spheres

i'm even thinking of rendering an hdr image of the scene, so if you guys want it, i'll do it

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v24/rodrigogua/cgtalk/coronachair_studiolighting.jpg

[JeffPatton]

When are you going to post your exploration with MR 3.5 in Max 9, it’s supposed to be better than the previous version?
Whenever new version shipped you came up with really nice exploration and added in this thread, I am eagerly waiting for the exploration based on MR 3.5, and I’m sure others as well!
Well as far as shaders/materials go, here's some details (and I'll try to keep it related to shaders only):

Physical-sky options - the new sun/sky setup works great. Many adjustments and you can even use the haze setting to add in clouds that have the color affected by the mrSun. You can use bitmaps or clouds or build up some procedural clouds like I did in this example:http://jeffpatton.net/tests/animated-sky.mov

Car-paint shader - I think this is the same one that was converted for Max8 a while back. But it's very nice and straight forward to use. One of the hardest to setup (IMHO) is silver metallic. Here are some examples where I used the mrSun & mrSky to test my silver paint settings against various daylight settings:
http://jeffpatton.net/tests/silver-1.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/tests/silver-2.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/tests/silver-3.jpg
I also have a few larger closeups of some metallic examples in my portfolio such as this gold metal flake example:
http://features.cgsociety.org/gallerycrits/11835/11835_1161004702_large.jpg
And a few more tests for good measure:
http://jeffpatton.net/tests/car-electric-plum.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/tests/car-tangerine.jpg

Then of course the new A&D material. Which is a real pleasure to work with. Fast, accurate, and a load of options such as: the ability to round edges add a touch of AOCC per material. Then there's the presets that quickly get you up and running with your materials. Here are some quick examples:
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/final-copper.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/final-metal.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/final-metal2.jpg
Pay no attention to my scaling issues with these. They are just tests.
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/Final-Concrete-formwork-wood.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/Final-woodflooring.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/test-cloth.jpg
http://jeffpatton.net/materials/Final-plaster-trowled-yellow.jpg
Of course it also does glass and even translucent materials:
http://jeffpatton.net/tests/translucent.jpg

There are many other things, but I think these items are the main material updates/additions. The other things aren't really related to shaders so I should leave those out of this thread.

Bottom line, this is a REALLY great update for mental ray users. If you are a mental ray user, you'll want to upgrade to Max9....plain and simple.

Sorry for all the images. If it creates a problem let me know and I'll convert them to links instead.

[rodrigogua]

those look sick. i want max 9!!

[slebed]

Hi Jeff,

Do you have any plans on releases that sky scene? If not, could you talk about how you created the clouds? I've been struggling to get clouds like that, but I can't seem to get it right. If this isn't the right forum, then perhaps you would consider emailing me.

Thanks

[egmehl]

That was a good overview, which I was just wanting to see earlier today. Has anyone done any tests with the built in render elements in this new version of Mental Ray? Do they work any better?


- Eric

[saiko]

Thank you Jeff!
You are the Mental Ray guru! I haven't seen anyone else exploiting MR like you!
The new tests are really cool! Really like the materials and the quality of rendering!

There is a time stamp on the top left corner of some of the renderings, is that a new feature in MR3.5?

Is there any other thread where you are posting more MR3.5 related stuffs?

Please keep posting more and get us inspired!:)

Cheers
Saikat

[JeffPatton]

There is a time stamp on the top left corner of some of the renderings, is that a new feature in MR3.5?The time stamp isn't something default with Max9. It's the handy-dandy frame stamp effect from Grant Adams. He's put a download link on his site here:
http://www.rpmanager.com/plugins/FrameInfo.htm

[rodrigogua]

been fidling around trying to get a matte gold shader. i've been also working more in getting studio lighting, and i ended up modelling an aproximation of a shooting tent (example here (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=254379&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation)). if anyone wants the scene or the material just ask, and if you've got suggestions, they are welcome!

all materials in the scene are dgs, except for the lighting panels, which are MR materials with glow shader in the surface slots. i painted the maps for these in photoshop, and they don't have the same intensity

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v24/rodrigogua/cgtalk/goldentorus_480.jpg

[Blitzo]

Do you have the scene available for download? I'd like to use the diffuse lighting shader you achieved there. I can do this in v-ray, but can't figure out how to do it in mr.

[Blitzo]

You may have a little too much black in your scene. I would place a white plane that partially covers that black area behind the camera. Offset the plane so the black is shown on one side. This will give you a more slender black curve on the gold shader you have there. Also, perhaps shift the yellow color to have a suttle amount of red, and desaturate it a little.

[Puppet|]

shaders_p 3.0
New shaders_p 3.0 released.
http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/download/shaders_p_e.shtml
Now all source code available.

Win32, Win64 and Linux32 versions.
Versions for Max8, Max9, Maya7 and Maya8.
MacOSX version is comming soon.
XSI version is comming soon too.

Add some old example images:

http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/fur.jpg
Fake fur specular in p_MegaTK shader.

http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/p_megatk_ward.jpg
Simple anisotropic(ward) in p_MegaTK shader

http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/gus.jpg
Glass in p_MegaTK

http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/interier_8_3bounce.jpg
Path Tracing in p_MegaTK

http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/path_test6.jpg
Path Tracing in p_MegaTK

http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/path_test7.jpg
one more example with Path Tracing in p_MegaTK

[saiko]

been fidling around trying to get a matte gold shader. i've been also working more in getting studio lighting, and i ended up modelling an aproximation of a shooting tent (example here (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=254379&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation)). if anyone wants the scene or the material just ask, and if you've got suggestions, they are welcome!

all materials in the scene are dgs, except for the lighting panels, which are MR materials with glow shader in the surface slots. i painted the maps for these in photoshop, and they don't have the same intensity

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v24/rodrigogua/cgtalk/goldentorus_480.jpg

Thanks for posting it Rodrigogua, like Blitzo said, I also find it difficult to get good studio lighting setup with Mental ray. You've got really nice results there!
(Only problem that I could see is the very light parallal lines on the upper portion, which is typical of MentalRay and generally visible near the contact shadow.)
But the contact shadow has come out really nice which I find really difficult to get using MR!

It would be great if you could share the scene file.
I would also like to know the render time for the above ( in case u remember).


Thanks Jeff for the rpmanager link!

Cheers
Saiko

[Mhyrdin]

Exept round edges i never found enough time to testing all the capabilities of MR 3.5 in Max9.
Now I have a good glimpse of them.
Thanks all and specialy Jeff for your explanations in this topic :)

[rodrigogua]

ok guys, thanks for the respones.

blitzo: you're right. i didn't take into account that shootong tents do have a panel there to bounce come light back. i'll work on a second version and check out the results.

saiko: the render time was a little over 5 hours at 3200x2400px and 150 000 final gather samples (which i am thinking is what got the contact shadows right). i re-rendered at 640x480 and 75 000 final gather samples. the sampling in both renders is set at 16 min, 256 max with mitchell filter and the stamp shows the rendering time:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v24/rodrigogua/cgtalk/goldentorus_480_2.jpg

you can download the file here (http://www.mysharefile.com/v/310840/goldentorus.zip.html). you need to copy the softbox2.tif file to the maps folder in your max directory for it to work properly. good luck!!

edit: apparently the link isn't working anymore. you an now download it here (http://www.mysharefile.com/v/7410463/1_goldentorus.zip)

[Blitzo]

Your light tent scene is amazing. I like how you physically concaved the sides. I'm doing a test render with a few adjustments as well. We can compare results. Thank you for the file.

[Blitzo]

I adjusted the color of the specular highlights. I added a hint of red, and reduced the saturation. I also added a "white card" to bring some light back into the scene. I've also introduced a "kicker light" in the black area. This brings a bit more highlight on the material. The render quality has been reduced to render more quickly. The metal may be a bit too blurry (not sure where to adjust this). Would this be in the DGS shader rollout?

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/384/gold1io1.jpg

[saiko]

Thanks for the response Rodrigogua! :)
I'd download and try it out.

But one question I have about the rendering setup, isn't 75000 FG samples too much for a 640x480 scene?! I've seen people achieving really good reasults using subtantially lower FG samples. I feel tweaking that u might be able to achive much better rendertime.

But to reduce the FG sample you need to tweak the Max Min values to avoid artifacts.

May be Jeff could help about this issue.

[rodrigogua]

i actually render tests with just 50 final gather samples (no typo, just 50) to get a rough idea of how things are going. i also lower the samples to min 1/4 and 4 max to make it even faster. here is an example, rendered in just over 20s:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v24/rodrigogua/cgtalk/goldentorus_480_3.jpg

this render shows version 2 of the shooting box, with a panel added behind the camera to bounce some light back, as suggested by Blitzo. this new panel does not emit light, it simply bounes a bit of it back at the torus. i also added the reflective sphere to show the box

Blitzo: the blurrines of the material is determined by the "shiny" parameter of the dgs material. the lower it is, the blurrier it looks

[KV99]

Yup, the original example is a serious samples overkill. I tried out settings ten times lower and visually the result was quite the same. Mental Ray settings, GI and FG are usually a step by step process, not all at once approach. I think Evermotions Maya MR dvd's explained the process quite well.

It's a good render though and the new one with better light distribution looks alot more realistic :)

[TTYO]

All that glitters is gold who yah!!!

Anyway is there a shader that can mimic velvet for Max 9?

[jacquess]

shaders_p 3.0
New shaders_p 3.0 released.

great work :) i'm downloading it as soon as i'll have some free time for experimenting
just one question: is there documentation availible for v3 shaders? (you said it will be :) )

[Puppet|]

Anyway is there a shader that can mimic velvet for Max 9?
For example p_MegaTK from shaders_p can do velvet, please view my previous post for link.

just one question: is there documentation availible for v3 shaders? (you said it will be :) )
Yes, but not completely. For example p_MegaTK shader documented. Docs also include 2 tutorials.

P.S. You also may try p_MegaTK shader for making good gold(it's more better than DGS, it has glossy sampling and some optimizations for multiple glossy reflections and refractions), metal, glass and anything you want :)

[Blitzo]

I had a look at p_MegaTK, there are so many settings. I definately will need to look at the documentation and tutorials to figure out this versatile shader.

[loran]

that s where Arch&Design Mat is powerfull because of independant material sampling from render sampling.so you dont have to enhance more than ever
http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/max9/goldentorus.jpg

[saiko]

that s where Arch&Design Mat is powerfull because of independant material sampling from render sampling.so you dont have to enhance more than ever
http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/max9/goldentorus.jpg

Oh Loran! I can't believe the render time looking the the shadow details and the glossy metal!
Could u please elaborate on the scene setup please?

What is the final gather smaple there?!

Could u please share the scene?

Cheers
Saikat

[EnlightenedPixel]

Looks to me like MentalImages took notes from Vray. Awsome render times and smoothness.

[maxplugins]

Just a heads-up to anyone that uses Geometry shaders in Max, I've recompiled the mrGeometryShaderObject plugin for Max 9 (only 32bit at the moment).

You can get it here:
http://www.maxplugins.de/r9_files/pavel/mrGeomShaderObject_max9.zip (http://www.maxplugins.de/r9_files/maxplugins/mrGeomShaderObject.zip)

Seems to work OK here...

Dave

Update: the link now points to Puppets version of the plugin for 32bit and 64bit Max 9

[Puppet|]

to maxplugins:
Here is mrGeomShaderObject.dlo for 3dsmax 9 win32 and win64 version. You may share it on your site. You may also update shaders_p.

[maxplugins]

Thanks Pavel,

I updated your shaders a week ago :o)

Dave

[lolo_aguirre]

I'm not sure if it is the correct thread to ask for it, but I've found lots of pages with VRAY materials, but only a few with MR materials (not shaders). I have the cg-mr.mat, but I want to know if there is any page where i can downlad more mat files for MR. I think it would be a great idea to make a file with the materials of this post (I cannot find it, I don't know if that file exists).

[Bao2]

I'm not sure if it is the correct thread to ask for it, but I've found lots of pages with VRAY materials, but only a few with MR materials (not shaders). I have the cg-mr.mat, but I want to know if there is any page where i can downlad more mat files for MR. I think it would be a great idea to make a file with the materials of this post (I cannot find it, I don't know if that file exists).

Mira fuera un thread con el nombre "Max9 mental ray shader thread?" en el que intentaremos emular lo que se está haciendo en maxwell y en vray: gente poniendo sus materiales uno tras otro. A ver en que queda el asunto.

Look the Max9 mental ray shader thread, we are trying that.

[lolo_aguirre]

Thank you, it's just the one I've been looking for!

[slebed]

I posted this in the max9 mr shader thread, but I wanted to repeat it here in case people missed it. This just seems really cool to me. The ability to easily write our own shaders.


http://www.antigravitylabs.com/Piltdown/index.html

Piltdown is a MR shader with a programming language built in that compiles at rendertime. Think of it like a renderman-like programmable shader. Hopefully people will use this an share their custom shaders. I'm off to create that marble shader I always wanted.

[loran]

here is th e goldentorus max9 file : http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/max9/goldentorus.max
http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/max9/goldentorus.jpg

[SamBe]

Hi the community,
I'm searching for a shader that simulate the wool of a sheep, someone can help me please?

Big THX!!!

[tryhard]

... hi i am looking for an output shader that creates different passes in one process.
- background
- diffuse
- shadow
- reflection
- ...

if i use render elements it takes much longer to render 10 passes then only the final image.

any idea ?

[Puppet|]

to tryhand:
Maybe p_MegaTK shader from shaders_p (http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/download/shaders_p_e.shtml)? It may do that.

P.S. Please view tutorial from docs about rendering passes.

[saiko]

Thank you loran for the scene!

[tryhard]

...to tryhand:
Maybe p_MegaTK shader from shaders_p (http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/download/shaders_p_e.shtml)? It may do that.

P.S. Please view tutorial from docs about rendering passes.


... yes it´s allways good to view the tutorials. Didn´t remember they were there.

Now I understand the purpose it´s made for a little better.

Thanks Pavel

Tryharder

[petere]

Hello,

Anyone have access do any documentation of the mia_exposure_simple shader provided in max9? I havent found anything and the docs provided in max9 are thoose for MR 3.4, very annoying.

Also, if you use log-exposure how would you set it up for it to correspond to gamma 1.8 or 2.2?

-P

[Spacelord]

Hello,

Anyone have access do any documentation of the mia_exposure_simple shader provided in max9? I havent found anything and the docs provided in max9 are thoose for MR 3.4, very annoying.

Also, if you use log-exposure how would you set it up for it to correspond to gamma 1.8 or 2.2?

-P

I've had a play with mia_exposure, Its pretty good, I'm pretty sure its a MR3.5 tonemapper.
When using it with physical sky it was best to set the Gain to 0.01.

[petere]

I've had a play with mia_exposure, Its pretty good, I'm pretty sure its a MR3.5 tonemapper.
When using it with physical sky it was best to set the Gain to 0.01.

yes, I have played around with it to. I have gain 1.0 and gamma 1.8 for my rendererings usually. But I am looking for some kind of documentation for the pedestal, knee and compression settings. How does they work and such.

-P

[Spacelord]

Here, this is what Zap had to say.

gain = a plain multiplier, i.e. "exposure" or "brightness"
gamma = gamma (duh ;) )
knee = a level at which highlights begin to be compressed. This is AFTER "gain" has been applied, hence only a 0-1 range makes sense, 0.75 good default, 0.5-0.75 useful range
compress = how much any light above "knee" is "squeezed down" in intensity

[petere]

thank you - it will do for now.

I am still quite upset with the hopeless ridiciluce crappy documentation for MR 3.5 in max9. ie. non-existent apart from the A&D-material.

-P

[Spacelord]

Yep Zap seems to be trying to change Mental Images outlook on documentation.
He did all the Arch & Design shader docs !! Pretty cool stuff.

[Abraham]

The A&D part of the documentation is definitly excellent mixing pure documentation and tutorial. Let's hope the more obscure parts of mental ray will get the same treatment in the future.
With this release mental ray is a real alternative to the other render engines avaiable (in raw power it always was, but not in ease of use) and the way shaders are made and "expendable" mental ray is in fact probably way above the alternatives, we just need more "insight" to unleash the beast :)
In any case kudo to Master Zap for his great work :)

J-L

[cpan]

heya Duncan,

do you happen to know aswell what does the Pedestal option?
also, what does teh "Preview" texture slot? does this works like francesca's ctrl_buffers tonemapping, with wich you can input your own image to be used by the tonemapper?


cya

[C-chan]

Ok, so I've been in and out of this thread for the last 4 months. I've done everything the thread creator's suggested/posted (as well as other posters input). I'm running Max 8 and using MR. I simply cannot get any results that look remotely like glass. I don't want to give up on this, but I'm terribly frustrated. I figure it's probably my inexperience with hdr maps and raytrace materials. Any suggestions as to why I'm screwing this up, even with the use of tutorials by experienced artists?

Thanks in advance!

[JeffPatton]

Well, here's what you can do:
1) Post an image (or link to one) that illustrates the look of glass you're wanting.
2) Post a render of what you currently have to give us an idea of what isn't working.
3) If at all possible, post the file for review instead of having to type all the info.

That should allow the folks around here to help guide you towards the exact glass material that you need. :)

EDIT: If it's an architectural type glass, I made a file containing several different glass types in this thread: http://www.vizdepot.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10203&postcount=36

[egmehl]

I haven't used these tonemapping shaders themselves, but in Combustion pedestal refers to a value added to each pixel. So if you use pedestal value of .4, the darkest pixel you will get is .4.

- Eric

[Spacelord]

to tryhand:
Maybe p_MegaTK shader from shaders_p (http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/download/shaders_p_e.shtml)? It may do that.

P.S. Please view tutorial from docs about rendering passes.

Hi Puppet, I was just looking at your shaders, very cool stuff.
Been through the docs and I only saw Maya docs, is there any for 3dsmax ?
I'm trying to do simple object passes, I looked at render elements but it renders
each pass separately (long render times) and doens't seem to play nice with Final Gather.
I use to use XSI and ctrl_buffers, so I do have a bit of understanding how it works.
I'm just a bit stumped how to do it in 3dsmax.

Like I like to use your buffer to output passes, but in combination with Max 9's Arch & Design shader. Will they play nice together ?

cheers

[disassembler]

I've got Daniel Rine's Diffraction Shader install correctly and have experimented with it in Refraction slot of a standard material and in the Surface slot of a mental ray material and can't seem to get it to work.

I've searched and cannot find an explanation of how to use this shader with max.

Any ideas or insight?

[Blitzo]

I finally got a realistic look to a diamond as I possibly can get without the use of HDRI's whatsoever.

This is using l_glass beta2 shader with the dispersion feature. This is direct off max; no post work.

If you've tried something like this without HDRI's, you'll understand the pain and frustration of getting some kind of natural coloring in the diamonds.

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2107/diamond6qz5.jpg

[disassembler]

here is what I get using the Diffraction Shader in the refraction slot of a standard Blinn.
http://www.dis-assembly.com/diffraction.jpg

[Puppet|]

to FuriousD:
Please read this thread, it's answer for your question:
http://mymentalray.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7

[tryhard]

I finally got a realistic look to a diamond as I possibly can get without the use of HDRI's whatsoever.

This is using l_glass beta2 shader with the dispersion feature. This is direct off max; no post work.

If you've tried something like this without HDRI's, you'll understand the pain and frustration of getting some kind of natural coloring in the diamonds.



... looks great. Could you post your settings or the scene. Would be a great timesaver if someone needs it sometimesw ...

thanks

tryharder

[Blitzo]

I'll post a screenshot tonight of the shader settings. The scene itself is almost identical to the one posted by rodrigogua http://www.mysharefile.com/v/310840/goldentorus.zip.html. Just ensure you have an accurate diamond model, and add some small chamfers to the diamond edges.

[rodrigogua]

wow, you used the shooting tent scene for the diamonds?! it does really look awesome!! great job with the shader!! did you add any standard lights, or just the shooting tent?

[Blitzo]

Yes, your scene setup worked perfectly for the diamond scene. I will be creating another lighting setup for a different scenario.

I only have one mr spot light that is creating the caustic effect. I'm using the Photon Basic shader for the caustics (couldn't get the l_glass shader to do it for some reason).

Here is the setup for the l_glass 2 beta shader:

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/618/diamondmattm4.th.gif (http://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=diamondmattm4.gif)

[tryhard]

Yes, your scene setup worked perfectly for the diamond scene. I will be creating another lighting setup for a different scenario.

I only have one mr spot light that is creating the caustic effect. I'm using the Photon Basic shader for the caustics (couldn't get the l_glass shader to do it for some reason).

Here is the setup for the l_glass 2 beta shader:



... thanks for the settings and the light tent.
I tried the photon base shader and it it produces caustics that only have the color of the material without the spectralcolors that diffraction is producing. So I also tried the l_glass 2 beta shader in the Photon slot:

http://www.3d-emotion.com/DOWNLOADS/images/KD_Diamond_C01.tifhttp://www.3d-emotion.com/DOWNLOADS/images/KD_Diamond_C01.jpg

It works but it´s hard to control the spread of the photons. I also didn´t find out how to control the caustic reflections ... Anyway the l_glass shader is a real beast ...

[Blitzo]

Looks great. How did you use the l_glass shader in the photon slot? I can't drag it into the photon slot, and l_glass doesn't show up as a photon shader.

[tryhard]

Looks great. How did you use the l_glass shader in the photon slot? I can't drag it into the photon slot, and l_glass doesn't show up as a photon shader.

... i think you don´t use the latest version of:
"l-glass v2 beta" that´s the exact name that shows up

I use a mental ray shader with "l-glass v2 beta" in the surface slot and I put instances in the shadow and photon slot.

hope that helps :-)

[Blitzo]

Have a link to the latest shader? I thought I had l_glass 2 beta...

[tryhard]

Have a link to the latest shader? I thought I had l_glass 2 beta...


... that´s the version i use:

http://www.3D-EMOTION.COM/DOWNLOADS/images/l-glass.rar

think it´s the latest ?

There is also a very interesting thread you might be interested in:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=334264&page=1&pp=15

[gulio]

Hi all,
I´ve played around with the ctrl_buffer shader for Maya with Max and got it to work - partly:sad:. Besides of many applicationcrashes it gaves me the alpha and normal channel, and I think it is the layer channel and also one channel with weird colors (and some black imgs too). Also the tonemapping is working. Unfortunatly the gui is rather clutterd which makes it a matter of trial and error to find out which function is what. I thought that I´ve read anywhere that someone posted that the ctrl_buffer shader is working in 3ds max, but maybe it was a daydream:shrug:. Has anyone else experimented with the shader and maybe better luck than me?

greets, gulio

[tryhard]

Hi all,
I´ve played around with the ctrl_buffer shader for Maya with Max and got it to work - partly:sad:. Besides of many applicationcrashes it gaves me the alpha and normal channel, and I think it is the layer channel and also one channel with weird colors (and some black imgs too). Also the tonemapping is working. Unfortunatly the gui is rather clutterd which makes it a matter of trial and error to find out which function is what. I thought that I´ve read anywhere that someone posted that the ctrl_buffer shader is working in 3ds max, but maybe it was a daydream:shrug:. Has anyone else experimented with the shader and maybe better luck than me?

greets, gulio

Hi Gulio, could you share a small test scene ...

[gulio]

Of course, tryhard your wellcome.
It´s a 3ds max9 scene with the latest ctrl_buffer shader. Remember to rework the output pathes. If you toggle the "makelres" it will output a probe.hdr with the tone mapping. Please don´t laugh about the material settings as they reveal the pure cluelessnes. :rolleyes:

greets, gulio

[tryhard]

Of course, tryhard your wellcome.
It´s a 3ds max9 scene with the latest ctrl_buffer shader. Remember to rework the output pathes. If you toggle the "makelres" it will output a probe.hdr with the tone mapping. Please don´t laugh about the material setting, they reveal the of pure cluelessnes. :rolleyes:

greets, gulio

Hi Joerg,

there ´s one thing you can be shure about:
I WILL NOT LAUGH

I tried it and i agree, without documentation it´s almost imposible, I think Francesca Luca might be able to help (also with max) but he´s not here ... :-(

There are some threads in the Softimage and the Maya section ... hmmmm

So maybe someone out there ???

[Blitzo]

... that´s the version i use:

http://www.3d-emotion.com/DOWNLOADS/images/l-glass.rar

think it´s the latest ?

There is also a very interesting thread you might be interested in:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=334264&page=1&pp=15

Thanks for the link! This one has a proper mi file for max; the dll file is exactly the same. The one I had was straight out of Maya. There were two key options in the Maya mi file that I had that weren't there: apply shadow, photon

Thanks again...

[petere]

This is a study with the new Arch&Design-material and the car paint-material in max9.

The model is curtesy of Andreas Wilen

Materials, lightning and rendering is me.

Rendertime: About 8 minutes on P4 3GHz + P4 3.2GHz
FG Rays: 250
Samples: 1/16
Filter: Lanczos 4x4
Num. light: 0
Flortexture from www.cgtextures.com (http://www.cgtextures.com)
Num. Polys: About one million
Resolution: 900x506

http://animate.petereriksson.net/dodge/dodge_pink.jpg

http://animate.petereriksson.net/dodge/dodge_turquoise.jpg

This one is just a photoshopmerged picture of the two above.

http://animate.petereriksson.net/dodge/dodge_blueish.jpg
-P

[tryhard]

Hi Petere,

that´s a great render. Perfect materials, lightning and rendering. I would like to inform you and all others here about a thread I have opened today:

VRay-like interior renders with mental ray???
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=429322

I think it´s time to open up a place where to share our experience with the new mentalray 3.5 for 3ds max. Your image also shows the big step forward that 3.5 means for us.

Would be great if you also post in the new thread :-)

Greetings

tryhard

[JeffPatton]

Just a note that the geolight shader seems to work a lot better for us (max users) with max9. I've even rendered out animations without problems. The only issue that I've run into is that it doesn't work if you assign more than one mesh to the geolight. Naturally, the work-around for that is to combine all the "light" meshes into a single mesh object.

Example:
http://jeffpatton.net/Temp/Obj-light2.jpg
(room mesh is the Howard B test room)

[rodrigogua]

wow, jeff. that sure does look impressive!!!

[tryhard]

... hi Jeff, stunning result!

my tests were also very positive. functionality, speed and quality.

geolights - that´s a great feature, now. very nice.

I would also invite you, as one of the "mentalray gurus", to this thread

VRay-like interior renders with mental ray??? (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=429322)

Your input would be really welcome !

Greetings

Klaus

[Spacelord]

Hi Jeff,
Which geolight are you using ? Is it Ctrl_studios or Puppets ?
cheers

[JeffPatton]

Which geolight are you using ? Is it Ctrl_studios or Puppets?Hmmm, good point...both were used actually. I used the mrGeomShaderObject.dlo mentioned at the bottom of this page:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=104578&page=236&pp=15
and that is created by Pavel aka "Puppet" (I assume).
But then I also used the ctrl_geolights shader on the geomshaderobject.

[Spacelord]

Hmmm, good point...both were used actually. I used the mrGeomShaderObject.dlo mentioned at the bottom of this page:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=104578&page=236&pp=15
and that is created by Pavel aka "Puppet" (I assume).
But then I also used the ctrl_geolights shader on the geomshaderobject.

Do you know if there is difference between the 2 ?
I'm hanging to try puppets path tracing ;)

[Argyll]

to maxplugins:
Here is mrGeomShaderObject.dlo for 3dsmax 9 win32 and win64 version. You may share it on your site. You may also update shaders_p.

I've installed the dlo and plugin mamager shows it's loaded, so where do I find it in 3ds R9 and how's it used?

[Ehren]

Is it a bug, or does the bitmap/photometric paths not work with the new A&D material? I change all my paths to UNC to setup a net-render, and A&D thwarts it. I gotta go manually dig the A&D materials I used out of the scene and change every bitmap path in it as they don't show up in the bitmap/photometric paths utility.

[maxplugins]

I've installed the dlo and plugin mamager shows it's loaded, so where do I find it in 3ds R9 and how's it used?

It should show up under 'mental ray' in the Create tab when you click on the dropdown list. If it doesn't, change your GUI preset to 'mental ray' (Customize menu > Custom UI and Defaults Switcher). Then it will show up.

Dave

[Steve Green]

Hi,

not sure if this is the appropriate thread since it's use of an exisitng shader rather than anything new, but one thing I liked in f-edge was the ability to specify filleting on specific edges.

I didn't see a way to do that in the A/D material, but then I worked out that the ever-handy vertex colours could be used to change the radius of the fillet on a per face or per vertex basis.

If you need to go larger, you can stick the vertex colour map under an output map and crank the RGB level up and it works a treat - not particularly accurate, but might be handy to some people.

Cheers

Steve

[maxplugins]

Is there any way of mapping reflectivity in the Arch + Design material? I've been puzzling over this all morning... I can map reflection color and glossiness, but I can't seem to map reflectivity.

Dave

[JeffPatton]

Is there any way of mapping reflectivity in the Arch + Design material?See if this helps:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=419576

[maxplugins]

Thanks Jeff, that's it. :thumbsup:

Dave

[seedo]

hello:



can u jeff tell us please how u did this
http://www.pixelperfectgraphics.biz/cg_files/Grass.jpg
thank u

[JeffPatton]

The grass was made with displacement. You can download that file (and most of the others I've posted in this thread) from my website:
Here are the really old Max6 files:
http://jeffpatton.net/Max6/index.html
Here are the somewhat old Max7 files:
http://jeffpatton.net/Max7/index.html
And here's an actual displacement tutorial I made not too long ago:
http://jeffpatton.net/MR_Grass_Displacement.htm

Finally, I've been posting some newer info in my blog here:
http://jeffpatton.cgsociety.org/blog/

[seedo]

wow thats great, thank u jeff u r very nice, u rock:buttrock:


yeeeeeeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[NOTORIOUS-ro]

Hi! I think I saw a link on this huge thread once witch lead me to a site where it explained how to make cd, lens and other effects like that. I'm mostly interested in the lens effect for a projector, it has something like a redish gloss to it. And just so I'm not missing anything.. does any of you guys know how to go around this thread easier because although Jeff was nice enough to make a summary on the 1st page it's still kindda difficult to jump between distant pages.

[jasonharding]

Hey guys, im new to this particular thread so i appologise if my first question is off the current conversation but here goes and hopefully someone can help me.

Im an animator and modellor, and occassional renderer with Brazil but now my workload has stepped up and i need to start doing alot more rendering. Ive not got along too great with Brazil and as we've just got max 9 i want to utilise the mental 3.5 shader. I have little experience with mental ray but have been playing around and got some nice results with the sky/sun and final gather.

For the next few months i will solely be modelling and rendering realistic products such as cameras, phones computers etc for an educational book. Can someone suggest the best studio lighting setup to get the most realistic results. The sky system works well but should i be including more lights and so on to get a more realistic result. I know the answer may be hidden somewhere in this thread but theres thousands of replies and im after an answer that best suits my needs. i tried downloading a studio scene setup posted on here but it appears it is for max 8, or at least wont render properly in max 9 and i want to use the new features mental ray 3.5 has.

Any scene setups you may be able to share will be greatly appreciated so i can learn from your techniques.

I hope this isnt too simple of a question or has been covered loads, i just have little experience with mental ray and dont have much time to play.

Thanks in advance!

[rodrigogua]

if you want a strictly studio setup, i posted i scene earlier in which i simulated a shooting tent. frankly, it is one of the best setups i've seen, and it is very versatile, so you shouldn't have much problem rendering different models with it.

hope this helps, and good luck

[jasonharding]

Thanks alot. I checked out your scene before but was just getting black renders. i realised this was because i was missing the softbox2.tif that has been applied to your glows etc. Am i right in thinking this softbox texture is just a plain white map? ive replaced this with white maps and it seems to render the same as your example image. Thankyou very much for this scene, looks like exactly what im after

[rodrigogua]

well, you can certainly use a simple white map, but the texture i provided is slightly more complex. it's more like a gradient, so that each panel emits more light from its center than from the edges, since that's the way it works in real life.

if you keep on getting black renders, you might want to check if your camera is inside or outside the box. if it's outside, nothing from the inside will be seen. also check that final gather is turned on or the box won't emit any light.

good luck!!

[shinnokSK]

Hello guys :)
Here is my procedural sand material. I used only raytrace mat., noise and smoke maps for diffuse, bump and displace..
Im new in making materials... so I m happy with this result :)
What do You thik? :)
http://www.studioharmony.sk/beach/SAND.JPG

[loran]

wonderfull Sand Material !!
can you shared it? or explain the way you do this?
thx

[shinnokSK]

wonderfull Sand Material !!
can you shared it? or explain the way you do this?
thx

Thnx ! :)
Yes..I will make small tutorial for it.. tomorow it shell be here :)
(sry for my englis)

[rodrigogua]

wow, that material is outstanding! can't wait for the tutorial!

[Mhyrdin]

Fine shader indeed !

A bit to smooth on the sphere but very realist on the ground :)

[XenObuS]

yes, it's great!
we wait the tutorial :bounce:

[shinnokSK]

OK quys.. here is the tutorial.. I hope it will be helpfull for you :)

http://www.studioharmony.sk/sand/tutorial.jpg (http://www.studioharmony.sk/sand/sand.html)

[XenObuS]

thank you, it's very nice :bounce::thumbsup:

[shinnokSK]

Ok guys. I'm here with my new test of cocktail procedural materials.. But I'm not ready with these settings yet. What do you think?
http://www.3dgrafika.cz/img/_gallery/25/25328.jpg

[quirin]

hi - i hope you don't mind, that i didn't go through all the 240 pages, because i'm
pretty sure this question already came up somewhere. i desperatly need a curvature shader
in max and found one for maya here:

http://www.tomcowland.com/mentalray/tc_curvature/

is there any possibility to convert this one for max?
i'm not very familiar with mr shaders, but as far as i know one has to change something
in the .mi file...?

thx,

quirin

[Mhyrdin]

OK quys.. here is the tutorial.. I hope it will be helpfull for you :)




Thank's shinnokSK !
The settings are well explained:)

[MasterZap]

Speaking of sand, here is a fun trick:

Use bump mapping, and then apply the same(ish) map to the "radius" of the "round corners" effect.....

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f366/MasterZap/sand-thing.jpg

...and you get "worn edges" for free... ;)

/Z

[shinnokSK]

MasterZap: coooool :thumbsup: i will try it :)

[shinnokSK]

My new test.. stylized visualisation of cocktail.. Render time 15 min.
Used only procedural maps. (no postproduction on render)
http://www.3dgrafika.cz/img/_gallery/25/25330.jpg

[Bao2]

My new test.. stylized visualisation of cocktail.. Render time 15 min.
Used only procedural maps. (no postproduction on render)


I could not resist this image so I was for a drink to the kitchen!

[urgaffel]

hi - i hope you don't mind, that i didn't go through all the 240 pages, because i'm
pretty sure this question already came up somewhere. i desperatly need a curvature shader
in max and found one for maya here:

http://www.tomcowland.com/mentalray/tc_curvature/

is there any possibility to convert this one for max?
i'm not very familiar with mr shaders, but as far as i know one has to change something
in the .mi file...?

thx,

quirin

The .mi file and the dll is included in the zip so you could try and put them in your maxroot\mentalray\shaders_autoload folder. The .mi goes into the "include" folder and the dll into the "shaders" folder

[JeffPatton]

Lightengine3d also has a curvature shader that you might want to try:
**link removed**

EDIT: My bad, that wasn't a mental ray shader at all....but a plugin for Maya. Sorry.

[mustan9]

This is a simple marble rendered in MR with caustics.

I would like to make a sandy ground with some stones for it to sit on.

http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/6442/marblesphereto1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[demoniorojo]

I´m searching a mr shader to loads darktree files into mr in Max but only for maya and xsi are available in the darktree web...anyone know a shader for max?...or must use scanline to use them?:sad:
Thanks

[micco]

Hello, I haven't followed this thread in a long time and I don't know if anyone have asked this already but anyway I'm going to ask this.. Have anyone noticed anything weird with that new Arch & Desing material and alpha channel? I mean the alpha channels sampling quality is really really bad when using that material. Any help with that?

[AnimG]

Hi guys, any of you experts offer some advice on Light Dispersion and ways to acheive it?

I started this thread here but possibly this thread would have been better.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=439329

Cheers
Anim

[tryhard]

Hi guys, any of you experts offer some advice on Light Dispersion and ways to acheive it?

I started this thread here but possibly this thread would have been better.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=439329

Cheers
Anim

... dispersion shader

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=104578&page=239&pp=15

[JeffPatton]

You may also want to unhide the "mib_glossy_reflection" and "mib_glossy_refraction" shaders from the base.mi file. They both have a dispersion option. Although I think I remember reading that it wasn't a true dispersion effect, but yet another way to fake it.

But that's only going to give you the dispersion effect on the surface material. I think you'll still want to use that dispersion photon shader since you're wanting the dispersion effect to illuminate out of the objects.

[AnimG]

Thanks for the advice guys.

Jeff, that might help getting the internal dispersion that is visible on real crystal, so I will have a look at those shaders tomorrow, cheers.

Anim

[Pixero]

I´m searching a mr shader to loads darktree files into mr in Max but only for maya and xsi are available in the darktree web...anyone know a shader for max?...or must use scanline to use them?:sad:
Thanks

I have made Max GUI declarations for the TIWDTE (The Image Works DarkTree Engine) shader.
(There is also the SimbiontMaya shader that should work with Max. The UI will be zero'ed out but might still work.)

You can find the TIWDTE shader at my site along with a explanation how to set it up. (It's for Maya but setup is the same for Max.)

By the way I have a few DarkTree shaders there as well.

Hope this helps!

Edit: I've made a small update to make linking of the DarkTree shader easier.

[demoniorojo]

Thank you Jan! i will try the shader tomorrow :)

[Pixero]

Just one note. You only need the .dll and the .mi file.

[demoniorojo]

I try it ...but dont work...in Max 9 (MR 3.5) and Max 8 sp 3 (MR 3.4) dont apears any new shader...:sad:. I copied them to MR folder autoload shaders file...it´s ok? thanks

[JeffPatton]

I don't know if Pixero's setup is the same, but at one point there was a 3dsmax + mental ray version on the Darktree site (I have no idea why it was removed)..But when it available, we had to setup an environment variable (in windows, nothing to do with 3dsmax).

Maybe this thread will provide some background info that might be useful to you:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=214723
Just keep in mind it's a rather old thread.

[Pixero]

Have you followed the steps on my site: http://www.pixero.com/downloads_darktree_howto.html

You Need to copy the TIWdtemental.mi from Max include to your shaders_autoload include folder.
The TIWdtemental.dll goes in the shaders folder.
You also need to download the DarkTree Engine components.
And dont forget to create a environment variable with the path to the DTE components.

[Pixero]

Jeff, It was probably the TIWDTE shaders that are'nt there anymore. The guy who wrote them died a couple of years ago and DarkSim dont have the source code. But as long as they work...
The ctrl studios Simbiont shader (for Maya and XSI) are more modern but personally I havent got them to work with displacement so I still use these.


demonirojo, You set the environment variable by right clicking your computer and go to settings, advanced, environment variable.
The setup should point to where you installed the DTE components. Something like this:
TIWDTE_COMPONENTS
C:\DTE\components\windows\

(Don't forget the last reverse slash.)

[Pixero]

Here is a picture of a poly plane with my procedural DarkTree brick shader and displacement.

http://www.pixero.com/bilder/pics/bricks.jpg

[tryhard]

Here is a picture of a poly plane with my procedural DarkTree brick shader and displacement.

http://www.pixero.com/bilder/pics/bricks.jpg

looks great. can you post the scene?

i have the shaders installed. i see 6 shaders (dark tree color, ... ) in my material/map browser. i also downloaded your shader. and now ...

i guess that i do not need the simbiont max 9 plugin. i have installed that also but get a error when loading: Simbiont9.dlt>failed to initialize. Error code: 487 - Es wurde versucht auf eine unzulässige adresse zuzugreifen

[Pixero]

The max simbiont is for max scanline. Not for MR. Here is the scene (Max 8).
You'll need the brickshader from my site. Downloads -> Darktree shaders.

http://www.pixero.com/stuff/bricks_test.zip

Oh, and I used the l_orenNayar shader as material but you could exchange it for a standard material.

Here it is: http://www.pixero.com/stuff/l_orenNayar.zip

[tryhard]

The max simbiont is for max scanline. Not for MR. Here is the scene (Max 8).
You'll need the brickshader from my site. Downloads -> Darktree shaders.

http://www.pixero.com/stuff/bricks_test.zip

Oh, and I used the l_orenNayar shader as material but you could exchange it for a standard material.

Here it is: http://www.pixero.com/stuff/l_orenNayar.zip



thanks a lot PIXERO.

what can I say: works great.

now i will take some time to understand how you did it and to try the shaders from darktree.

So, one more time: THANKS :thumbsup:

[tryhard]

... BTW i just got the newest simbiont max 9 pluging for the scanline renderer from darksim support.

It should soon be downloadable here:

http://www.darksim.com/html/download_simbiont2.html

good night everbody :rolleyes:

[tryhard]

... for those who are interested:

Puppet has updated his shaders to version 3.01 (http://www.puppet.cgtalk.ru/download/shaders_p_e.shtml)

most importand for me: p_Mega TK_pass works in 3ds max 9

my experience till now:
all materials have to be Mega_TK
all lights need the mr light shader connected
lights must have the right attenuation type (0,1,2 - none, inverse, inverse square) to function !!!
- photometric Area = 0
- standard spot can be controlled in p_pointTK !!! 0,1 or 2 - be carefull
- ...

[_FZ_]

I'm using p_3 shader for Max too!!
It's a great tool..

Now I'm wondering how can I get matte pass using mega_tk, I need to render a plane as "invisible", but with the shadow casted on it from other objects..
Matte/shadow material is obviously ignored when I got render passes, so is there a way to use mega_tk shader as matte/shadow material? http://mymentalray.com/forum/images/smilies/frown.gif

(I tried to change cOpacity and Opacity Conversion for the mega_tk shader used on the object that I want as matte, but I obtain only an invisible object, no shadow on it, nothing)

Last but non least, I've difficulties to render z pass, only red channel without gradient or grey pass.

Also often I got normal pass (bent) problem, it's not calculated and in the final render pass I found holes, bucket trails, or only something is rendered correctly.. is it a bug?

[Puppet|]

Last but non least, I've difficulties to render z pass, only red channel without gradient or grey pass.
Common z information contained in R channel (it's float)
G channel - reflection Z
B channel - refraction Z

Also often I got normal pass (bent) problem, it's not calculated and in the final render pass I found holes, bucket trails, or only something is rendered correctly.. is it a bug?
Did you try enable occlusion?
'Bent Normal' pass it's not 'Normal' pass!
'Bent Normal' - average normal from occlusion direction from missed rays.
If you need 'Normal' pass just use mental ray normal pass.

[_FZ_]

Did you try enable occlusion?
'Bent Normal' pass it's not 'Normal' pass!
'Bent Normal' - average normal from occlusion direction from missed rays.
If you need 'Normal' pass just use mental ray normal pass.

Sorry, I'm referring to Bent Normal. However sometime the pass is wrong, and I don't know why (for example I've redone the maya tutorial in max and the bent normal was corrupted, the rest was rendered fine)

My big problem now is the matte/shadow, no idea how obtain the same result

[Puppet|]

My big problem now is the matte/shadow, no idea how obtain the same result
Render shadow and do it in your compositing software.

[_FZ_]

Render shadow and do it in your compositing software.

Oh yes, but I have double rendering, passes from mega_tk and no matte objects, than shadow from render elements and matte object with matte/shadow (and now the objects are trasparent)
It works, but it's not so direct in a large scene workflow

But thanks anyway!

[demoniorojo]

:bounce: yeah! finally works! the shader works and loads the darktree files without problems! Thank you very much ...I´m very happy:applause:special thanks to Jan and Jeff for your help :thumbsup:

[pluMmet]

It's been a while since I messed with mr. Recently I've seen some nice skin shaders and thought to give it another go (I haven't tried since R7.)

Does anyone know of some pages here in this thread where it's discussed?

[JeffPatton]

I don't think we've had a discussion on the skin shader here. There's a small topic on using the fast skin shader for things other than skin (like plastic or wax), but that's about it. However, the info at lamrug.org and especially Zap's tutorial both do a great job of breaking down the workflow.
http://lamrug.org/resources/skintips.html

[pluMmet]

I don't think we've had a discussion on the skin shader here. There's a small topic on using the fast skin shader for things other than skin (like plastic or wax), but that's about it. However, the info at lamrug.org and especially Zap's tutorial both do a great job of breaking down the workflow.
http://lamrug.org/resources/skintips.html

A great help! Thanks Jeff :)

[demoniorojo]

hi again...exist a Max version of francesca´sctrl_multidisplace shader ? it´s very impresive....:love:

it manages up to 8 different displacements at same time :eek:

[Spizzy]

I'm having some strange lighting things happen in my scene and was hoping for some help.

The setup is pretty much identical to Jeff Patton's scene posted wayy earlier with one directional light and one skylight. The scale is the same so I don't think thats the problem.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/Spizzy/design%20stuff/1.jpg

The problem is in the corners of the room, on the left side near the floor I'm getting that red glow, and similar on the right side with the yellow glow (though its not as noticable because the window is there). Also note the light coming from behind the wall hangings. Thanks for any help!

edit: using max 8

[bgawboy]

Need more info...

Materials?

Is there FG or GI? Keep in mind the indirect light search radius (FG max radius, GI photon radius), which may incorporate light if it can't quite determine whether the normals of the nearby FG points or photons apply to the intersection point. Usually, one models thickness in the walls greater than the radii.

How thick are the walls near the lit areas?

For the light on the right, I can't quite make out the model, is it a beam with a notch in it? Can you check the normals?

[MarcoTomaselli]

i made just a car paint test (max 9)...

C&C are welcome.

thanks

:buttrock:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=107075&stc=1

[ElmarNieser]

Hi There!

Can anyone help me find a nice silvergray/silver car paint material for MR in max9? I tried playing around with the car paint material that comes with MR. But I can't get it right. I tried searching this topic for a nice silvergray/silver car paint but I could not find one, the link is dead.

Thanks!

[JeffPatton]

Can anyone help me find a nice silvergray/silver car paint material for MR in max9?
Do you need semi-accurate or fast?

Fast = The car paint shader or any material that allows you to configure a specular highlight. Just keep in mind that you'll just need to setup some lights to make the paint work properly.

Semi-accurate = Use the A&D material as the base material in a shellac map. Setup the A&D material as a dull reflective metal and the shellac as the clear coat layer. This works well, but can be slow.

[everlite]

Hi guys,

I need to create a bloby goo effect, similar to hair gel maybe, with internal bubbles. This is for an animation so i need to create something that's reasonable fast to render. Anyone done anything similar and can share a few pointers? Not sure about the internal bubbles, i guess particles would do for this?

Cheers - David.

[MarcoTomaselli]

anybody can help?

enter here:

http://mymentalray.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1318&posted=1#post1318

download the scene there...

thanks!!!

[Almir]

Hi:
Just finished a car showroom, 1.400.000+ Faces, Added GI and FG, the thing though that has been bothering me for so long, the Saving to FGM thing; final gather is so computing extensive, so, I save it to an fgm, but it's also VIEW-Dependant, so the 14 camera shots I want to do, equals 14 computations of the FG points, now correct me if I'm wrong here, why the &%*$ would I use an fgm to store FG points? to save them to desk instead of memory? ok, If my scene contains FG related shaders, like Glow(lume) for example (Which is the case in my cars headlights and other stuff), then It must computed for every frame/Camera? :curious:, and dude, wouldn't pretty much suck if I would make an animation of the showroom, that means my poor FG(400 samples), needs to be recomputed in vain( in vain = nothing is moving, I'm changing Views), I would accept it if something moves or changes contributions to the photon mapping (like in radiosity, light is PAINTED, and still you can take different shots without things having to be recomputed).
The Max manual said something about storing the fastlook up data in the FGM, and It did, but heck, recomputing FG for every Angle really sucks, any way around this? jeff?
:surprised

[JeffPatton]

Almir, your post should be in another thread since this thread is about shaders (not lighting).

But in a nutshell, the saved .fgm will save you some render time by only adding samples where needed instead of recomputing the entire frame. You can also use the frozen option in Max9 to keep max from computing the fg map once you have a good solution saved. For example (depending on my camera path & scene), I could render from my camera view, save the .fgm then render the scene FACING my camera (180 deg. from previous render), add that to my .fgm then turn on the freeze option and render away. Of course that's provided my camera doesn't turn and look somewhere my FG calculation missed. So what I'm trying to say is that if nothing moves or the lights don't change then you can plan where you need to incrementally add to your .fgm, then freeze the solution.

Naturally as you said, if you have objects that move, or lights/glowing objects that change intensity...then you'll just have to let it incrementally add to the .fgm as needed.

Some additional info here that might be helpful:
http://www.cgarchitect.com/vb/20096-flythroughs.html

Ok....back to shader/material stuff. :thumbsup:

[vizwhiz]

marco said


anybody can help?
enter here:
http://mymentalray.com/forum/showth...sted=1#post1318
download the scene there...


well This may NOT be what you are expecting
(i might be well beyond help) but here is my result
just Two objects, plane and Torus & mr sun/mr sky

The water is ok just default A&D water material added few Tweaks
how would i add shaders To The Torus To make it more 'dramatic'?

randy

[StratusFarm]

HOLY COW, Jeff...
Your thread is pushing 1 million views :eek:
That column is gonna get pushed out by another digit soon.

Anyone wanna start a betting pool?
I predict March 3rd of this year.

This thread has been a wealth of information...its kept me from having to post a question on a few occasions.
Thanks to all who contribute!

[loran]

I'm just trying to render physically correct glass. I use Arch&Design mat with the physical glass settings. One photometric light.
I can't have good highliths even with tricking with an behind the light object with an overbooster RGB output. This is the only way to start to see highlights! Even with this it comes wrong ://

Any expert to enhance this? thanks!

http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/mr/causticGlass.jpg
max9 file (http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/mr/causticGlass.max)


http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/mr/glass-reference

my indigo render test:
http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/images/galerie/indigo-glasses-prev.jpg (http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/galerieperso.html)

[Ingsoc75]

I've been diving into Max 9 mr Arch+Design material and love them!

However there is an effect that I have been unable to achieve even using the help file (which in my opinion is very good).

The effect is of an aluminum metal that overall has a gold look to it but at certain angles has a redish 'luster' to it.

Attached is an example photo of the type of material I am trying to achieve.

Regards

[mustan9]

I'd blend between two materials, and use a falloff with some noise.

[MarcoTomaselli]

Hey Loran...

I made a test too...

i think that the HDRI is the solution for your scene man...and more caustics photons.

but i used dialetric shader in this test...if you want the scene...tell me...i don´t have more space to upload this now...so i can send an email.

i used photoshop..for color correction, grain and blur edges.

[JeffPatton]

I've started using the blog function here at CGtalk to post some mental ray tips/info: http://jeffpatton.cgsociety.org/blog/
I know it's a bit out of the mainstream, but it serves it's purpose until I can find the time to revamp my own website.

EDIT: I also added links to these useful sites on the first page of the thread here:
http://www.mymentalray.com/index.html
http://www.mentalboutmax.com/
http://mentalraytips.blogspot.com/

[loran]

i think that the HDRI is the solution for your scene man...and more caustics photons.


Thanks but I don't want to use HDRI. My test was about MR physical ability ... And I m not very convince about.

A friend of me made a vray test in minutes which is very correct.

[Dodgeas3d]

Hi all!

I've got some problem with fast sss skin. Is there any way to have fast sss to work under reflectivity coat. I mean when i put sss in blend or shelac i loose sss scatering... simply i want to have control on sss fast skin reflection. Couse built in reflectivity in sss fast skin works strange, when its mirror reflections its ok but when add some blur it blurs it as anisotrofic reflection :/

max8 max 9 same problem.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

Ahhh jsut figured out searching whole 2 hours..... lightmap thing :/

[Steve Green]

Hi,

I've been tinkering with the AD material (particularly the edges chamfer effect) and wondered if anything like that exists as a map.

It seems like it would be very useful as a mask for chipped paint, but I haven't found anything which will do that (apart from f-edge which doesn't work in MR)

http://www.stephendgreen.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/robot.jpg (ignore the wafty background)

The blending between non-welded meshes is great, but it would be fantastic to have a shader that could do a map on the sharp edges. Does one exist?

Thanks,

Steve

[TnB]

HI ALL i have been watching this thread for a long time,and starting from a carpant from here,i have done this,nothing special,but i want to do a a paint specially for the use of hdri only!the problem is that even if we can use hdri to light a scene it doesnt make highlights,like a normal light!i want to get those nice flakes without using a omni light or anything else like that,because its hard to match the light from the omni[or spot] with the one from the hdri,it is noticeable with the reflections!I hope i dont bore you guys with this,anyways this thread helped me alot already.if you can improve this or understand my "problem" post anything!

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1506/blue1tm3.th.jpg (http://img299.imageshack.us/my.php?image=blue1tm3.jpg)
the image is rendered with MR in 20 mins,only skylight & HDRI [1000 sples,2 bounces]
http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/7230/paintblue1zr3.th.jpg (http://img159.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paintblue1zr3.jpg)
as you can see the paint doesnt look too good on the car ;i have too change the color,lighter or something[this one rendered in 20 mins also,bu with lower settings]

[TnB]

i have got my hands on the MR carpaint shader,i love it... it solves my problem
heres some with my wip car:

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/5753/carblackuz0.th.jpg (http://img183.imageshack.us/my.php?image=carblackuz0.jpg)

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/2075/carblueik1.th.jpg (http://img183.imageshack.us/my.php?image=carblueik1.jpg)

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/4324/carredvq3.th.jpg (http://img147.imageshack.us/my.php?image=carredvq3.jpg)

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/1487/carsilverdv6.th.jpg (http://img403.imageshack.us/my.php?image=carsilverdv6.jpg)

some comments or suggestions would be appreciated!

[sergo.pogosyan]

I used a grass bump map in the MR displacement slot to make this patch o' grass. Material is on a low poly plane (4x4 grid)

http://www.pixelperfectgraphics.biz/cg_files/Grass.jpg

I've tried your grass shader, but with no success. My grass is not enough fine as yours, could you please upload somewhere that plane with your shader. I think there's problem with units used in max... I'm working in milimeters.
Thank you.

[StratusFarm]

OK, this is driving me nuts.

I have been trying to render in passes.

Using the max Render Elements: certain mental ray shaders just render black, such as the lume and SS shaders, and it also needs to spend time rendering each pass seperately so it is time consuming

Using p_MegaTK: You have to use the p_MegaTK shaders on each object, which is rather limiting, from what I experimented with so far, plus the rollouts for the Max version are a bit confusing as some of the dropdown choices are only numbered choices, unlike other App's implementation (things like choosing a file format, compresssion, etc.) and I haven't found anything showing what number choice relates to what. I have done a little trial and error for the file formats, but often wind up with errors when I try to open them, presumebly because I can't set the compression or something correctly.

Using ctrl_buffers: this seems the most promising, as I can place whatever shader on an object I want. However, the Max implementation is also rather confusing in terms of the UI, and I also have not found any write up describing how/where to place the shaders.
Right now I am trying something similar to the other ctrl_shaders, such as creating a mrShader object in the scene to hold the buffer_api shader, and putting a buffer_write shader in the Camera's output. This isn't working yet, although it could be the settings.
I suspect I am not placing them correctly.

Can anyone give me a basic HowTo for setting up the ctrl_buffers shaders?
besides the "buffer_api" and the "buffer_write", there is also a "buffer_store", but that doesn't come up as an option for the mrGeometryShader object or for the Camera Output.

Any help or good word at all would be much appreciated.

[gulio]

hi luckymutt,
this is what I have experienced too. In the post no. 3577 and the following, there is a test file you can try out. But as I wrote, there is no solution implemented. I believe the ctrl_buffer shader and the belonging ctrl_write and ctrl_store have to be customize to 3ds max. Unfortunately it seems that francescaluce has stoped contributing to this community (the latest post is from the 10-25-2006). So, I think there is no other way than using the render elements to get the passes of choice.:shrug:

[StratusFarm]

Yeah, i saw that test scene, but Max 8 can't open it. I also tried merging it into a new scene, but no luck.
Can you send me a quick "what shader goes where" message?
I'd at least like to play around with it, compare the screenies from Maya and XSI and try and figure out what goes where.

Besides the added time to using Max's Render Elements, several of mr Shaders only render black, like the lume shaders. (which really bothers me that not only has autodesk not made it work yet, but I didn't see anything forthcoming in the user reference about it)

thanks.

[simmsimaging]

Hi all -

I've finally read through this entire thread - thank you very much to everyone who has contributed to this fantastic resource. I'd love my first post to be a contribution instead of a question, but I'm brand new to Max, MR, and 3D in general so I don't have much to toss in at this point.


I'm having some trouble with the "shader list" shader in MR. I'm using it to mix a couple of bump maps together and I keep finding that for some reason it's replicating the bump maps I have added to it. I can't seem to figure out why. In the shader list mat I've added two Max Bump map shaders, one with a cellular map, one with a noise map. Every once in a while I go back in to the shader list (which is in the bump slot of a MR material) and I find it's replicated one or more of those maps, so I end up with 4-6 shaders in there - which craps out my render.

Has anyone had this problem, or know how to fix it? Someone posted a question about this quite a while ago on another thread, but no one really answered.

Thanks in advance,

Brett

[gulio]

Hi luckymutt,
I´ve created a max 8 version of that file. At least it spits out 5 black images and a zdepth file. There are also 2 warnings and an error msg in the MR console window. This is only quick and dirty adoption of the settings in the max 9 version. I´ve to check if it´s possible to get at least some passes out, like the max 9 version does. I hope this can help you and I think it´s a good idea to compare this with the setups in Maya and Xsi. Good luck and keep us informed if you have any success.

greets, gulio

[StratusFarm]

Thanks gulio.
It will prolly be a few days before I can dig into it.
I fI have any success or ideas to make it work I'll be sure to post.

[BlackFire86]

I'm just trying to render physically correct glass. I use Arch&Design mat with the physical glass settings. One photometric light.
I can't have good highliths even with tricking with an behind the light object with an overbooster RGB output. This is the only way to start to see highlights! Even with this it comes wrong ://

Any expert to enhance this? thanks!

http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/mr/causticGlass.jpg
max9 file (http://laurent.renaud.free.fr/divers/mr/causticGlass.max)




Do you mean something like this?

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/6257/causitcphotohc7.jpg

[loran]

BlackFire86, I need the same file I send, same point of view, your test is different from mine because your light is maybe 4 x4 meters I don't know...
My problem is that Hightlights with Mr seams to be anything but realistic and you have to tweak a lot to achieve a "correct" result.

watch the physicaly correct render (http://www.indigorenderer.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_gallery2&Itemid=26&g2_itemId=6402)

[BlackFire86]

loran,
do you mean caustic=highlight?
i dont know what ur highlight mean..

[gulio]

loran,
I think you have to use area lights to get the desired effect.

[loran]

no caustic doesnt mean highlights.
just try to reproduce equal quality of Infigo render with Mr. there is nearly no highlights with Mr! even with area light visible, I have to create a object with overboosted rgb output mapped to fake this.

[everlite]

Hey guys,

Shortly i'm going to be doing a project that requires a few metal / rusty objects seen up close and was just wondering if anyone has any good tips on creating a convincing material / shader, any ideas or thoughts you could share.

Mainly small street objects, letterbox, pipes, bins, that kind of thing.

It's not something i've touch on that much so I was going to investigate the new metal shaders in MR and see what i could come up with.

Any pointers greatfully accepted.

Cheers - Dave.

[Cgmystic]

everlite (http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=77909)

Try making your texture via this tutorial.

http://67.15.36.49/team/Tutorials/stefan_morrell/stefan_01.asp
Then apply to your scene.

Another method would be to use DarkTree procedural textures
http://www.darksim.com/index.html

Jan Sandstrom has some neat DarkTree prefabs:
http://www.pixero.com/downloads_darktree.html

earlier in this thread there a discussion about using Darktree method:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?p=2007470&highlight=Darktree#post2007470

:wise: (http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?p=2007470&highlight=Darktree#post2007470)

[everlite]

Thanks for the feedback, however the tutorial you suggested is more orientated towards painting the texture effect apposed to the the shader setup ... i think.

I'll investigate the second option also.

Cheers - Dave.

[SoLiTuDe]

Hey guys, i was just messing around with the arch & design shader (mia) on the stanford dragon. The question I have is on viewport performance with the shader. If i use a standard blinn shader i'll get around 20 fps rotating around the 871,446 poly model. When I apply the arch&design shader i get about 9fps or so... any reason for this? Any way around it? I tried many other mat. types and all seem to work fine...

Thanks!

[hjalle]

Thanks for the feedback, however the tutorial you suggested is more orientated towards painting the texture effect apposed to the the shader setup ... i think.

I'll investigate the second option also.

Cheers - Dave.

Everlite, try this. I use a mix of vertex paint and lume landscape shader. I suppose you don’t wont to struggle with UV editing, but you can paint only a mask to mix shaders.

[Steve Green]

Hi Ian,

I've not noticed viewport perf problems (although I haven't looked yet), but I have noticed that multi-subobject materials in the material editor are much, much slower when mr is used for the material editor. May be there's a connection?

- Steve

[paulc]

First off apologies for raking up a really old thread

.I need build an environment featuring lots of icebergs and I've been using the beautiful iceberg setup on jeff patton's website (thankyou for that by the way, I've learnt loads from all those files.) But as soon as I change the environment to anything other than black it all goes AWOL.

Now I've noticed a couple of scenes on page 73 of this thread that have a couple of scenes where this isn't a problem, but the links are dead.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=183&t=104578&page=73&pp=15

So if anyone can tell me if these file are still available, or if the know what is going wrong with this scene (see attachment)


Found the answer I think. I just put an output material set to zero in the local environment.! (if anyone's interested)

[ctrl.studio]

Hi luckymutt,
I´ve created a max 8 version of that file. At least it spits out 5 black images and a zdepth file. There are also 2 warnings and an error msg in the MR console window. This is only quick and dirty adoption of the settings in the max 9 version. I´ve to check if it´s possible to get at least some passes out, like the max 9 version does. I hope this can help you and I think it´s a good idea to compare this with the setups in Maya and Xsi. Good luck and keep us informed if you have any success.

greets, gulio

Hi there, thanks for testing but do not spend too much time on that as it simply can't work on 3dsmax for the while. I'm working on a new version where there'll be also a 3dsmax version.

max

[SoLiTuDe]

Hi Ian,

I've not noticed viewport perf problems (although I haven't looked yet), but I have noticed that multi-subobject materials in the material editor are much, much slower when mr is used for the material editor. May be there's a connection?

- Steve


Yeah it's wierd... it might have something to do with the poly count for that scene, but it still shouldn't really affect it. It's def. trying to do something else when the mr mat is applied. I don't think it has anything to do with the mat editor... the mat editor actually does a small render of it of sorts, where the viewport... well... it should just be a color and a highlight, but who knows. :) I'll see what happens with some dif scenes, and just ask that some other people test it out.

Thanks again,
Ian

[gulio]

Hi there, thanks for testing but do not spend too much time on that as it simply can't work on 3dsmax for the while. I'm working on a new version where there'll be also a 3dsmax version.

max

Hi max,
that´s definitive good news :bounce: for the 3ds max community as we were not able to participate in the advanced rendering features of the ctrl_buffer shader in the past. So, if we can be of any help with testing or what ever, please don´t hesitate to request assistance. :):):)

greets, gulio

[erilaz]

Hi guys. This is a tonne of useful information, with the slight draw back of it being all in one huge thread. What I would like to suggest is we start to break the useful tidbits into the CGWiki Mental Ray section (http://wiki.cgsociety.org/index.php/3ds_Max/Mental_Ray). I'm suggesting the same thing for the particle flow thread as it's getting cumbersome also.

[demoniorojo]

Hi mr gods! I´m looking the features of a very nice shader,T2S_Illumination,but don´t found any information of max version ,anybody know about max mi for T2S_Illumination shader?

[demoniorojo]

I´m doing some test renders with the maya mi and seems work,but by default all the values are 0...at first time it´s confusing,lot of values and options so looks great...i´ll post some test, the coating option is very exciting :thumbsup:

[JeffPatton]

Thanks for the info Javier. I had never heard of this shader until your post. I'm testing with it now as well and it is VERY interesting indeed. Good find! :thumbsup:

[JAF]

I was trying the T2S shader too ;)
If Jeff can ckeck this and if it's ok, just add this to the .mi file created by Jan Sandstrom (Pixero):

gui "gui_T2S_Illumination" {

control "Global" "Global" ("uiName" "T2S_Illumination", "category" "Illumination")
control "seed" "integer" ("value" 0)
control "WrapLighting" "scalar" ("value" 0.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "bump" "vector" ("value" 0.0 0.0 0.0)
control "DiffuseColor" "color" ("value" 0.474 0.474 0.474)
control "OrenNayar_Roughness" "scalar" ("value" 0.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "Glossy_Mode" "integer" ("value" 1, "range" 0 3)
control "Shiny" "scalar" ("value" 50.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Shiny_U" "scalar" ("value" 30.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Shiny_V" "scalar" ("value" 70.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Base_Shiny" "scalar" ("value" 30.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Edge_Shiny" "scalar" ("value" 100.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Shiny_Falloff" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "Optimization" "integer" ("value" 0, "range" 0 1)
control "ReflectionEnable" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "Samples" "integer" ("value" 8, "range" 0 128)
control "ReflectionColor" "color" ("value" 1.0 1.0 1.0)
control "RefractionEnable" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "RefractionColor" "color" ("value" 0.5 0.5 0.5)
control "Samples_Transp" "integer" ("value" 8, "range" 0 128)
control "Enable_FresnelMask" "boolean" ("value" 1)
control "Fresnel_Method" "integer" ("value" 0, "range" 0 3)
control "IOR" "scalar" ("value" 2.0, "range" 0.0 50.0)
control "MediaIn" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Fresnel_Mode" "integer" ("value" 0, "range" 0 2)
control "AbsorbtionCoeff" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 20.0)
control "ReflectionBaseWeight" "scalar" ("value" 0.2, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "ReflectionEdgeWeight" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "ReflectionEdgeFalloff" "scalar" ("value" 10.0, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "FresnelPreset" "integer" ("value" 0, "range" 0 22)
control "Fresnel_CustomFilePath" "string"
control "Fresnel_DebugMode" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "EnablePhong" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "EnableBlinn" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "EnableAnisotropic" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "EnableLafortune" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "PhongColor" "color" ("value" 1.0 1.0 1.0)
control "Phong_SpecularDecay" "scalar" ("value" 50.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Phong_Weight" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "Blinn_Color" "color" ("value" 1.0 1.0 1.0)
control "Blinn_Roughness" "scalar" ("value" 0.2, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "Blinn_SpecularRefraction" "scalar" ("value" 10.0, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "Blinn_Weight" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "Anisotropic_Color" "color" ("value" 1.0 1.0 1.0)
control "Anisotropic_LinkShiny" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "Anisotropic_ShinyU" "scalar" ("value" 10.0, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "Anisotropic_ShinyV" "scalar" ("value" 10.0, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "Anisotropic_Weight" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "Lafortune_Color" "color" ("value" 1.0 1.0 1.0)
control "Lafortune_Model" "integer" ("value" 3, "range" 0 6)
control "Lafortune_CustomFilePath" "string"
control "Lafortune_RollOff" "scalar" ("value" 20.0, "range" 0.0 20.0)
control "Lafortune_Weight" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 2.0)
control "Weight_Diffuse" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 2.0)
control "Weight_HighLights" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 2.0)
control "Weight_Reflection" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 2.0)
control "Weight_Refraction" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 2.0)
control "Weight_Irradiance" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 2.0)
control "InputNoise" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "EnableNoise" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "Noise_Mode" "integer" ("value" 0, "range" 0 1)
control "Noise_Weight" "scalar" ("value" 0.4, "range" 0.0 0.5)
control "Noise_Brightness" "scalar" ("value" 0.5, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "NorthVector" "vector" ("value" 0.0 1.0 0.0)
control "NorthMode" "integer" ("value" 0, "range" 0 1)
control "NorthRotation" "scalar" ("value" 0.0, "range" -180.0 180.0)
control "InputBumpFactor" "scalar" ("value" 0.0, "range" 0.0 0.3)
control "Bump2Diffuse" "boolean" ("value" 1)
control "Bump2HighLights" "boolean" ("value" 1)
control "Bump2Scattering" "boolean" ("value" 1)
control "EnableCoating" "boolean" ("value" 0)
control "FilmIOR" "scalar" ("value" 2.0, "range" 0.0 10.0)
control "FilmThickness" "scalar" ("value" 1000.0, "range" 0.0 1500.0)
control "InterferenceWeight" "scalar" ("value" 1.0, "range" 0.0 1.0)
control "ReflectionExposure" "scalar" ("value" 0.0, "range" -1.0 1.0)
control "Refraction_AttenuationDistance" "scalar" ("value" 15.0, "range" 0.0 100.0)
control "Bitmap_T2S" "string"
control "array light" "lights"
control "hardwareColor" "color" ("value" 0.5 0.5 0.5)

}

Good luck and post some samples (enabling RefractionEnable crashing my MAX v.7.1 but working fine with the v.9.0 demo... :/)

[theotheo]

any news on the ctrl_shader and ctrl_buffer shaders? :)

-theo

[demoniorojo]

HI jaf! thank you for the mi !! I´ll test it this afternoon :thumbsup:

[JeffPatton]

I was trying the T2S shader too ;)
If Jeff can ckeck this and if it's ok, just add this to the .mi file created by [size=2]Jan Sandstrom (Pixero):Works fine for me. Attached the updated .mi file that includes your GUI control edit.

[JeffPatton]

I just updated my blog with the T2S_Illumination file links and an example image where I used the coating feature to create a color shifting paint material.
(link to blog in my sig)

Has anyone else noticed that the Lafortune highlight option + FG seems to produce unwanted light? It may be my settings, but just wondering.

[demoniorojo]

yes! for me works too! good job!:) and lafortune+fg= strange artifacts...specially with bump and reflection:shrug: it´s a shader problem

[demoniorojo]

any news on the ctrl_shader and ctrl_buffer shaders? :)

-theo

I´m trying the maya mi of ctrl_shading ,but reflection and specular don´t work in max...i think that the next version will have max version too

[ctrl.studio]

I´m trying the maya mi of ctrl_shading ,but reflection and specular don´t work in maxtake care that ctrl_shading is a multioutput shader. so you have to plug the 'compound' output to your slot in the mat editor to see also spec and reflect, if not you'll have to encapsulate it in a phen while layering out with a mib_interpolation or such(add mode).

also in 3dsmax there's already the a&d material.. that I don't know why you need the ctrl.shading. :)


max

ps: Hi Jeff !!! I just realized you're here.

[demoniorojo]

thx...so i pluged it intake care that ctrl_shading is a multioutput shader. so you have to plug the 'compound' output to your slot in the mat editor to see also spec and reflect, if not you'll have to encapsulate it in a phen while layering out with a mib_interpolation or such(add mode).

also in 3dsmax there's already the a&d material.. that I don't know why you need the ctrl.shading. :)


max

ps: Hi Jeff !!! I just realized you're here.
thnx! but I plugged it in compound mode but reflection and specs don´t work...but don´t worry they are only for testing purpouses :)

[theotheo]

ctrl.studio , the a&d shader doenst function correctly with the render elements (multipass rendering system in max) And it doesnt spit out all the passes in one render, so you can estimate the rendertimes to go through the roof since it needs to re-render every pass (including fg on each pass).

I've used Puppet's mega_tk shader abit but i find it too abit lacking, especially since you can't use other shaders (all the miss shaders for instance), so hoping the ctrl.shading and buffer stuff would solve some of the issues. There are some testing on some new framebuffer shaders over at lamurg, perhaps there's a solution on the horizon :)

This is the only thing that makes me evaluate other render engines aswell :)

-theo

[JeffPatton]

ps: Hi Jeff !!! I just realized you're here.Hey Max! Sure glad to see you around here as well. :thumbsup:

[demoniorojo]

yes! render elements is one of the biggest problem of the Mr implementation! other renderers such as final render (I use it in max 8) have a very nice compatibility with render elements with a lot of new outputs...but sometimes that´s very hard with MR :sad:
Another cuestion....ctr_multidisplace work with max?...I try it in maya and it´s a great shader but i don´t know how use in max...

[seedo]

hello guys:

can anybody please help me how to make my object glow or get a neon effect.

thank u

[rodrigogua]

hello guys:

can anybody please help me how to make my object glow or get a neon effect.

thank u

that has already been addressed in this thread. check the index in page 1 or search it.

jeff has a great example scene in his site too

[Puppet|]

I've used Puppet's mega_tk shader abit but i find it too abit lacking, especially since you can't use other shaders (all the miss shaders for instance)
You can use any mr shaders, but you need connect it to p_MegaTK shader because other shaders don't support spliting out passes. For example in doc you may find tutorial about using fast_sss shader with p_MegaTK.

And you'll have same problem with any shaders that compute passes or buffers (not p_MegaTK only, for example with A&D too).
If you need connect custom passes you may use SpecialC channels, it's like ctrl_buffer slots.
If you need more custom passes use ctrl_buffer shader, but in some case it maybe slower and have some problem with sampling. And don't forget that you should create all passes manually (sometimes it's not so simple and sometimes is not so correct).

p_MegaTK is more automatic solution, but ctrl_buffer more manual.

[chrisnobles]

Has anyone developed a shader that can re-create the stress when plastics (such as polypropylene) go white when folded or creased? Eg a dvd case spine

Or, anybody know how i could achieve this?


Thanks
Chris

[JeffPatton]

Just posted a very small .mat file containing some A&D ceramic materials on my blog (link in my signature).

Here are the material test renders:

(click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah_grn-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah_grn.jpg)

(click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah_irr-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah_irr.jpg)

(click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah_orng-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah_orng.jpg)

(click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/buddah.jpg)

Toilets-n-sinks (click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/Sink_material-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/Sink_material.jpg)

(Max9 only)

[cschoo]

First off, I want to say Thanks to Jeff for all his amazing efforts here (and everywhere in general)... I've been following on and off for a long time! I hope that soon I will be able to be give back to this great community

I have a question about water shaders... I've done some testing to try and get some nice ones, which can be seen here (http://cschoo.wordpress.com/2007/01/29/caustics-finally/)

Something that I have had trouble understanding is getting caustics to work with a parti-volume shader. I know Jeff has shown a really nice example of it on his blog, but I was wondering if anybody could share any tips. I think the thing that is confusing me is where I should be putting each shader in the Arch & Design material. Thanks to everyone in advance...in the meantime check out my blog (linked in my sig) and I'll keep testing away!

btw...I am using Max9 and always model in a feet and inches and tend to use mr sun and sky a lot...

[JeffPatton]

I think the thing that is confusing me is where I should be putting each shader in the Arch & Design material.
Hi Chris,

I didn't have much at all setup on that material. Just an ocean(lume) shader for the bump map and the parti-volume shader in the volume map slot (bottom of material in the mental ray connection rollout).

Beyond that, if you run into shadow problems like I mention in my blog and you're certain that the "refract light and generate caustic effects" option isn't the issue...then drop a dielectric photon map into the photon slot of the mental ray connection rollout.

[brro]

how can i use the mr prim hair with the mr shader.....the rendercolor must mach the material color....see my attachment please...because i have some issue that the final render don't mach the material colorimages/icons/icon10.gif.

[Mhyrdin]

Hi everybody !
I was preparing an exercise with geolights for my students and that's what i got !! :eek:

http://mhyrdin.free.fr/bug-geolights/bug_thb.jpg
(clic to enlarge)

The vertical cylinder became horizontal ....
Has somebody encountered this ? a bug ?

Here is the scene (Max9)
scene : geolights103.max (http://mhyrdin.free.fr/bug-geolights/geolights103.max)
archive : geolights103.rar (http://mhyrdin.free.fr/bug-geolights/geolights103.rar)

I got it only in this scene, I've done another one without any problem :shrug:

Thanks for looking this post.

[JeffPatton]

Yes, currently the geolight deal is extremely buggy and unpredictable in 3dsmax. It's a great concept and it seems to work great in Maya...but I really wouldn't recommend teaching it to students since it's unreliable in 3dsmax.

For some reason it's placing the geolight near that back wall. If you turn off the objpreset option on the geolight settings, you'll see both the geolight and your original mesh. Then, if you turn off the lightvisible option, it won't display the rotated cylinder at the back wall...but that's still where the light is emitting from.

So, as you can see it really has a mind of it's own at times. :argh:

[demoniorojo]

Do you try to put the geo-dummy and the area light source at the origin (0,0,0)? I solved lot errors with this setting :)

[Mhyrdin]

Thanks for your reponses Jeff and Javier (es tambien el nombre de mi hijo ...:) )I never had problem before with geolights and i have to learn it to my students because they are (future) designers and they often create very special lights and lightning systems :shrug:

I have done some tests more and i discover that the omni get the orientation of the object before to generate the geolight. Here with the vertical cylinder the X orientation is 90° when i change it for the omni to 0° all becomes correct.
There is also a correspondance between the position of objectlight in render and omni after generating geolight

http://mhyrdin.free.fr//bug-geolights/light_position_thb.jpg (http://mhyrdin.free.fr//bug-geolights/light_position.jpg)


So, as you can see it really has a mind of it's own at times.

You're perfectly right Jeff .....

[MrElmo]

hey whats worse is that we dont have a mix8layer in mental ray for max :sad:

[demoniorojo]

Hi MrElmo (http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=13001) ! I have good news for you, Jan (Pixero) makes our life easiest :thumbsup: take a look to JS_MultiLayers, his mod of mix 8 layers, but with more slots...It´s a VERY usefull shader

download here: http://www.pixero.com/downloads_mr.html

[simmsimaging]

Hi all -

Has anyone figured out how to load the presets for the T2S shaders? I wanted to play around with some of them to get a feel for the parameters for some water/glass I'm working on, but can't figure it out.

Any help would be appreciated (I did look on their site, but couldn't find it there)

Thanks in advance
b

[iopiop]

Hi all
I'm trying to reproduce a plastic bottle with liquid inside ... but I'm having problems ...
I'm Using 3dsmax 9 with mental ray and it's new arch & design material

I'm close of getting what I want but there is that black part that is appearing at the
bottom.

Please have a look at the two pictures ...

http://www.legzdesign.com/gallery/d/543-1/Spin_006.jpg

http://www.legzdesign.com/gallery/d/541-1/002.jpg

I'm using the glass preset with 1.64 IOR ... transparent shadows etc ... the thing is that the bottle alone looks ok ... but as soon as I add water ... the dark bottom thing appears...

The plastic bottle & the water surface "intersect" but maybe it's not how I should do it ...

If you have any tips for me it would be appreciated ...

Thanks

Louis

[mustan9]

try increasing the number of reflection and refraction rays used by MR. This can be found in the MR render settings.

When a refracted ray bounces to it's max. It returns black.

[iopiop]

Thanks for your reply Mathew ... I've tried what you told me without success :sad: ...

After that I've tried the other method described in the help file (the one describing that it is preferable to consider the refraction in regard of "interface" instead of "by media" as they say)

I'm not getting much better results ... maybe it comes from my surfaces ... they are nurbs comming out of rhino !

Well I'll post the results of the computing tomorrow ...

Thanks

Louis

[kaizerscythe]

Hi, another MR noobs here. I want to ask about geolight shader. How can i make the light more brighter, like what Jeff demonstrate int the earlier post. Is geolight shader by itself can lit entire scene? (for example a room full of stuff). I try adding as much geometry and attach it as a single geometry but still too dim. Adding another light and another seed of geolight doesn`t seem help. I try to add a normal light but as a result the geolight effect dissapear. Please help, thanks before.

[DBKenn]

Say Jeff when you say Wrapped in a clear coat on your blog do you mean shellac? And how do you get it clear.

[iopiop]

http://www.legzdesign.com/gallery/d/545-1/test_20_Mars_02.jpg

Here is the result of the calculation using the "interface method" proposed by the help file ...

Not much better

once again if someone has any tips ...

Thanks

Louis

[JeffPatton]

[img]Here is the result of the calculation using the "interface method" proposed by the help file ... Not much better

once again if someone has any tips ...
What about adjusting the object properties of the water mesh and disable the receive and cast shadow options?

Say Jeff when you say Wrapped in a clear coat on your blog do you mean shellac? And how do you get it clear.You can use the shellac material. For example, create a shellac material and put a standard material into the base map of the shellac material. Then put an A&D material in the shellac material map swatch. Then just set the A&D diffuse color to pure black to keep it from contributing to the base color (shellac is an additive effect).

Hi, another MR noobs here. I want to ask about geolight shader. How can i make the light more brighter, like what Jeff demonstrate int the earlier post.
Simply adjust the options on the actual light that you assigned to the geolight shader. As a side note, I preferred to leave the "lightdefaultoverwrite" option off on the geolight shader and adjust the samples/settings on the light as normal.

EDIT:
I also just added a few more materials to my blog, like this electron_microscope material:
Electron microscope material (click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/E_microscope-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/E_microscope.jpg)

[pcbyers]

Here's a question: Is there anything similar to a mipmap swapper that can be used within Mental Ray or Max in general? As in, a scripted behavior on a bitmap slot that would change out the image for a low-res proxy, based on distance from the camera. You might even want to turn off bump/normal mapping at a certain distance to cut down render overhead.

A plugin like that would have been nice to have this afternoon, when MR kept having memory crashes at minute 29 of a 30-minute render.




______________
I'm sorry, Mr. Patton, but it doesn't look good. You've got little hairy teapots floating through your bloodstream. I'm afraid Mental Ray has taken over your body.

[Mhyrdin]

............I also just added a few more materials to my blog, like this electron_microscope material:
Electron microscope material (click to enlarge)
http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/E_microscope-thb.jpg (http://jeffpatton.net/Blog-images/E_microscope.jpg)

Very funny picture and a great shader however ! Thanks Jeff :thumbsup:

[RJI]

Hi there,
have aquestion, how can i create an Mental Ray material like this:

http://www.renderomat.com/makethumb.php?pic=uplimg/2007_clad1_fcdc82cfc891e1eafa2a864148114afc_mainpic.jpg&w=500&b=Y

its an V-ray material on this site:
http://www.renderomat.com/classified.details.php?id=52

thanks for lookinghttp://forums.cgsociety.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

[MrElmo]

Hi MrElmo (http://forums.cgsociety.org/member.php?u=13001) ! I have good news for you, Jan (Pixero) makes our life easiest :thumbsup: take a look to JS_MultiLayers, his mod of mix 8 layers, but with more slots...It´s a VERY usefull shader

download here: http://www.pixero.com/downloads_mr.html

is it able to mix on shader level just as mix8layer?

[RJI]

Hello,

I have a queation, how can I create an MR material like this in 3 ds Max 9:

http://www.renderomat.com/makethumb.php?pic=uplimg/2007_clad1_fcdc82cfc891e1eafa2a864148114afc_mainpic.jpg&w=500&b=Y

thanks for looking http://forums.cgsociety.org/images/icons/icon9.gif

[Pixero]

is it able to mix on shader level just as mix8layer?

Use as material shader and apply your different shaders/textures to the layers and use the different blend modes just like with layers in Photoshop.

Sadly the interface in Max isn't as good as in Maya.

http://www.pixero.com/bilder/pics/JSMultiLayers3.jpg

This is simply because there is no way of getting dropdown menues in MR shaders without also coding a Max SDK shader. Something I don't know how to do.
The current way with integer numbers makes it hard to remember which inumber for example the "screen" blend mode had. I really wish they would make it easier to do better gui for MR shaders in Max.

[demoniorojo]

:scream: yes! max must have better meditor scripting like maya AETemplates...in maya, shaders are easier to control...I hope a solution for this problem from autodesk guys...

[everlite]

Hi guys,

Very soon i'm going to need to give some thought to a material that i need, to be honest it's a little hard to describe let alone create.

Ok, so if you can imagine a glossy translucant material. When i think about it, it's kinda like a car paint material with SSS with a slight diffused transparancy. Not sure, maybe it's easier than i thought. Is is possible to combine the Car paint with SSS? It's a little similar to Sunny from i,robot.

Any thoughts or suggestions really appreciated.

Cheers - Dave.

[demoniorojo]

Hi everlite :)mmmhh try to combine frosted glass with volumes...similar to sss_glass shader in the first post of this thread,I think that it works similar that the I robot shader...but i read a technical paper about this film in 3dworld magazine and this shader seems very complex to emulate,because considers incidence angle,distance and a lot of parameters..

[everlite]

Cheers, though it doesn't need to be too technical, just something translucant and shiny, that can be animated in a reasonable time. I might just use the SSS and make it glossy. Though i don't think you can create a transparancy with SSS? not sure, any pointers? I probably will use Sunny as a reference, having just noticed the DVD earlier it's very similar to the final idea.

Cheers again - Dave.

[F3LIC3]

Why don't you try the A&D Material with its translucency?
I think with the A&D it must be possible.

[everlite]

Cheers, the frosted glass is pretty much spot on, never thought to look at what was already there :)

[demoniorojo]

Hi this is a start...very slow shader,because the volume shader...but seems like the I robot material:thumbsup:
here´s the .mat file and a sample image

[everlite]

Hey thanks, though your first suggestion of using the A&D frost pretty much hit the nail on the head.

http://www.thedaveidentity.co.uk/web/tls.jpg

Notice around the base of the breast the diffused translucant effect between the two surfaces, that's the kind of thing i was looking for.

Thanks again - Dave.

[MrElmo]

Use as material shader and apply your different shaders/textures to the layers and use the different blend modes just like with layers in Photoshop.

Sadly the interface in Max isn't as good as in Maya.

http://www.pixero.com/bilder/pics/JSMultiLayers3.jpg

This is simply because there is no way of getting dropdown menues in MR shaders without also coding a Max SDK shader. Something I don't know how to do.
The current way with integer numbers makes it hard to remember which inumber for example the "screen" blend mode had. I really wish they would make it easier to do better gui for MR shaders in Max.
Hey Pixero, yeah I use your shader in maya software mode, its really bummers we cant get a better user interface in max. Perhaps Master Zap knows a solution? But Im afraid you allready talked him about it and there really isnt an easy way. I hope mental is going to make an official cross platform mi layered shader .

[Coolhand]

Hi guys, this is a fantastic thread, i've learned a lot from it. I'm having some problems with this diffraction shader (http://animus.brinkster.net/stuff/plg_diffraction/plg_diffraction.html) and i can't seem to find any solution in here. Basically, why is there no .dll in the archive? what do i have to do with the files that are in there to make it work? i'm guessing this is the source code and it needs compiling or something, i've read that mental ray will compile them by itself but i haven't a clue how to do it.

Does anyone have the Dll that i can use?

Any help is much appreciated!

[JeffPatton]

Basically, why is there no .dll in the archive?The .dll is in the nt-x86/package sub-folder of that .zip file.

[Coolhand]

Awesome... Thanks Jeff, this is a great thread!