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TheShaddix
11-12-2003, 03:35 AM
Hi all, this is my new car (for those who havent seen it before).
I hope you like it.
Description: modeling in maya NURBS. Rendering in MRay.
Also, ive made a simple animation. It's a little too simple, but still, it took me an entire day to render.

http://www.vertexstudios.net/Gallery/mercedes.jpg
http://www.vertexstudios.net/Gallery/mercside.jpg
http://www.vertexstudios.net/Gallery/mercinside.jpg
http://www.vertexstudios.net/Gallery/mercfrombehind.jpg

TheShaddix
11-12-2003, 03:36 AM
http://www.vertexstudios.net/images/mercinside.jpg

http://www.vertexstudios.net/images/merctop.jpg

http://www.vertexstudios.net/images/mercrear.jpg

http://www.vertexstudios.net/images/mercroofup.jpg


The animation : http://www.vertexstudios.net/images/benzcamera.mov

charithmax
11-12-2003, 03:51 AM
Great work! i like it!

i think u should adjust the reflections a bit.reduce the reflection amount and use a falloff effect and anialias the reflections so that ur model will look more realistic in the environment.

also create the environment in a way that the car will be prominant in the scene.i think u shouldnt use heavy patterns or bumps.

keep the good work going!:thumbsup:

Sqwall
11-12-2003, 06:33 AM
The model looks good. But the car got an awlful plastic look. You shoud try doing some new materials and remodel the head lights. ;)

TheShaddix
11-12-2003, 08:07 PM
I posted that car here to see see what people think of what ive done. Im not gonna change anything. THanks for some positive feedback.

Supervlieg
11-12-2003, 08:08 PM
Really nice model, but you really should reconsider those materials. They don't do the model justice at all. This could be top notch if you can get rid of that plasticky look.

TheShaddix
11-12-2003, 09:15 PM
I dont get it, why does it look like plastic? What do you mean by that? Please dont mention the headlights because it's a weak part, i dunno how to make them real.
Be specific when u say "reconsider materials", because ive spent a lot of time on getttin that kinda look, mental ray is a hard thing to be good at.

shadowstalker
11-12-2003, 11:19 PM
I have to agree with supervlieg. The car material looks like plastic indeed. It seems to me that you didn't want critics.
You said that you dont know how to make it look real. Now that's why you are here. To get helpful information to improve your skills. But anyways the modeling is great!

TheShaddix
11-12-2003, 11:41 PM
Now, this is wierd. I asked to be specific, and u guys tell me its plastic, i dont even know what to do. Its made in maya, rendered with mental ray. If anyone can tell me how to make it more real, please do so, id be more than happy to try and improve it.

I used HDRI map for reflections, and a polygon box around it which i mapped the HDRI onto to make it sharper.

Njen
11-12-2003, 11:52 PM
The lack of shadow definition makes the car feel like it is floating. I would consider decreasing the reflection on the floor.

Colourwise, I think the images are too dark overall. Try lightening it a little with a bit of sky/area light.

The glass looks like it is very thin. Try adding some more thickness to it.

The inside of the car looks far too smooth. Add some bump to it, and check to see why there is light underneath the seat, that looks a little strange.

Cheers!

JasonA
11-13-2003, 12:28 AM
nice work, the model looks very good:) nice job with those nurbs! I agree about the lighting in these renders, it needs alot more light so we can see the geometry better.

:buttrock:

TheShaddix
11-13-2003, 01:00 AM
Ok, ill try to post better renders, but the problem is that its not polygons and its hard to map a texture onto nurbs surfaces, so im not sure about that bump on the interior parts, but ill see what i can do.

Jason A, thanks for your reply, nice mclaren.
And i appreciate ya'll comments.

Goro
11-14-2003, 04:29 PM
Nice model. Did you assign a simple phong shader on that car?
Try to adjust the shader a little bit.
Go into hypershade and create a ramp (in textures menu set) and a sampler info node (in utilities). Then connect the Facing Ratio of the samplerinfo node with the V coordinate of the ramp. Set the ramp colors to almost black to gray. Then connect the ramp with the color node of the phong shader. Now the reflection depends on the facing angle of the camera. It should look more realistic.
About the lighting. Create 2 or 3 area lights (mental ray arealights) and turn on raytracing.

I'm not very good in rendering but I used mental ray the last couple of weeks. Check out my space taxi. It is rendered with mental ray. There is a link below in my signature.

If you want you can send me your maya file per mail and I will try to make a cool rendering.

kunal
11-14-2003, 04:40 PM
Modelling is nice but poor lighting is running down the whole image. Better try fixing the shadows underneath the car. Keep it up, U can make it.

TheShaddix
11-14-2003, 09:48 PM
THanks people.
Ill work on that stuff you all told me. I know that i should add more shadows underneath, and obviously i see all those mistakes that you mentioned, its just that to make it more real, i gonna have to deal with the headlights and rearl., the interior texturing, and the whole scene around it.
THe reflections come from a HDR image, because it works good, but as i can see, not in my hands.
Ill try to render a bettter image. It's just a matter of time.

Novakog
11-15-2003, 04:00 PM
What he said about the ramp before is what's called the fresnel effect (http://www.3drender.com/glossary/fresneleffect.htm) where the closer the "ray" of the camera is to perpendicular with the surface normal, the more reflective the surface is. That should really help your model.

The other thing I always say (and it usually helps) is to make use of HDRI reflections in Mental Ray (your last image seems to do this, but the others don't).

TheShaddix
11-15-2003, 04:13 PM
Oh, it's called "ramp"? Ofcourse i know what that is; it's like a falloff in max. Hmm, i think it should give me a pretty good result, but for what? For my car or for the scene objects? A quick question: How can i get a full use of HDRI? I created a polygon box, removed the bottom face, then mapped HDRi onto it, and the car is inside. It gives me sharp reflections, but maybe it's not the right way to do it?
Tell me how!

Novakog
11-15-2003, 05:04 PM
You should assign a enviroment map to the car's reflection itself, I'll write up a tutorial on both Fresnel and using an HDRI env map briefly (although HDRI enviroment map tutorials can be found just about anywhere).

TheShaddix
11-15-2003, 05:37 PM
Nah, that's not gonna work well. If i assign an env. map to the car, it's gonna be all messed up for it's NURBs. THe question was how i can make the HDRI more useful.
And i guess that i shouldve made the whole scene in 3d, because that way the scene would give the car that needed reflection instead of a low-res HDR image.
But it sure would take more time to render. Now it takes around 4 min per image, but i dont care if itd take more than that, i just want a photoreal look.

JasonA
11-15-2003, 05:50 PM
Don't forget that you can override the default NURBS uv coordinates by using projections instead of normal textures. I do it often when my uv's are non very workable on a nurbs surface. Just make sure you parent the place3dtexture node for the projection to the object its projecting onto or else your textures will 'swim' off the surfaces when you animate them.

Novakog
11-15-2003, 05:56 PM
I don't know what you are talking about, an enviroment map works perfectly well for NURBS as well as polys in Maya. An enviroment map doesn't texture the surface, it creates an enviroment to reflect.

Wait, and that takes 4 minutes to render? With all the bumpy reflections? What kind of machine do you have?

You probably don't need the second part of the tutorial (you definitely seem like you already know) but the first part is just a tutorial (with pictures) of what the other guy said before with the ramp (and yes, this does work with NURBS): http://www.cgrenaissance.com/index.php?page=Fresnel

P.S. Your HDRI method should work fine but the reflections don't seem bright enough to be HDRI, that's why I thought they weren't.

TheShaddix
11-15-2003, 07:01 PM
WHat do u mean? the bumpy reflections? Nah, it's like a low-res small image made in PS, then used in maya with a bump, and thus the reflections look bumpy and nice on that floor.
Without that floor and the cage around it, it takes about 2 min to render with HDRI and all that raytrace, but the floor standalone takes about 2 min too. So it's about 4-4:45 to render one frame,
And ive rendered 200 of them in that animation on the first page of the thread.
To your question on what machine i use:
Athlon 3000+,
1GB Ram
ATI 9600pro
Thats about it.
ANd i have another system which is pentium 2.4, 1 gb Ram, and it takes about the same time to render.

Novakog
11-15-2003, 07:03 PM
Ya, by bumpy reflections I meant "bump-mapped reflections", anyway, even though you said you wouldn't, you should rerender it with the Fresnel/Falloff thing, I think it could be an awesome render if you did.

TheShaddix
11-15-2003, 07:22 PM
OK, im gonna render the best i can now, so ill just replace one of those images on the first page, because the admin said that i cant update the gallery thread or it'll be moved to WIP section, heh.
Ill try to use that ramp thing too and a different HDRI map, or no map at all.

TheShaddix
11-15-2003, 07:59 PM
WHy does it say, IMage conversion to IFF failed when i try to open a texture file(.jgp)

Novakog
11-15-2003, 10:45 PM
I have a lot of problems with .jpg files in Maya, I used to always use BMPs but then I downloaded the IFF plugin for PS (you can get it off highend3d.com), so now I can save and open Maya's propietary image format in Photoshop.

More to the question, Maya just has a crappy jpg reader and writer.

TheShaddix
11-16-2003, 04:05 AM
OK, thanks for your replies man.
Ive rendered more images, and i think they look better than they used to. Check them out on the front page!
I also tried to use default maya leather texture for the interior.

supermanphan
11-16-2003, 07:25 PM
i'm not sure what you're talking about, texturing in NURBS isn't all that hard, a lot of things are actually easier about it than polys, that's why people still argue which is better, because they all have pros and cons

Frenkie
11-16-2003, 07:55 PM
hi!
nice work!
the front part of the car is not the best,the interior lokks great!
the front window is too flat.you should take the car into a real enviorment!

TheShaddix
11-16-2003, 07:59 PM
Ill try that. I know about the front being not accurate and all, but it's my first nurbs car. Ive never rendered anything in maya before that car, so thats why my renderings arent the best either.

Novakog
11-16-2003, 08:43 PM
The new renders are much better, but the fresnel should be even stronger (it should be 100% reflective at the very edges), look at my avatar (the Modena) and how it's even white in some parts (despite the fact that it's painted red); that's a 100% untouched photo.

Also, I think the specularity is a little too diffuse (part of what contributes to the plastic look). If you're using a Phong E shader, lower the roughness a bit.

But as it is, you shouldn't post any more renders, these are fine. Just remember that stuff for future ones.

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